Drill Holes in Admiral

[Tony F]

Hi guys, I've been watching this Admiral set and have serious concerns over the holes someone has drilled in the face around the screen. I'm assuming this was done to keep the screen mask in place. The hole in the top right corner (that has no screw) isn't even in-line with the other holes. Considering this would seriously detract from the value. I am trying to imagine repairing this Kludge with JB weld and painting the surrounding area (kind of like a picture frame) with a brown paint that was close to the original bakelite. I know it would never look "correct". It is a real shame it was done originally, but "Back-in-the-day". I guess it didn't really matter too much. Thoughts ? The set also looks like it is missing the metal rear cover as well as the High voltage cage cover.
Tony

[Tony V]

Your bigger concern is in the fact that the picture tube is blown judging by the dark spot in the middle of the screen. The bad picture tube, missing covers and the screw's in the case unfortunately mean's there is little value except for parts. The screws are probably there from where a magnifier was installed back in the day.

[Sandy G]

Yeah, too bad yr CRT's Toast, 'cause it looks like a pretty nice set otherwise. If the cabinet isn't cracked/broken, you MIGHT consider getting a replacement CRT from someone here, going thru the set & restoring it to working condition. If its a 10 or 12 set, those CRTs are relatively common, as are the majority of the other tubes. A WORKING one of those sets, thwy're NOT that rare or especially valuable, but they are neat as all hell-and GREAT conversation pieces. Plus, just having a WORKING 1948-50 era TV is a kick in & of itself. Kids are almost always totally AMAZED by them.

[kvflyer]

I have used J. B. Weld to repair the broken mounting holes for the back cover of my Admiral 26R12 Bakelite cabnet. Ther material was broken off and I built it up with the product. It adheres and drills well.

So, if you do get this set, that would be an option.

[Sandy G]

Hard to believe that the 10 & 12 inch screen sets were considered "Large Screen" in their day. But, you gotta remember, TV was just barely beyond a laboratory & experimenters' curiosity, & the "State of the Art" was advancing almost on a daily basis. 5 inch CRTs were as big as ANYONE needed, Pilot was cranking out their 2-3" "Candid" models like there was no tomorrow. In any large town, you could walk into a radio shop, plunk down roughly 100 bux, & bring home a 2-3" TV kit, which would likely incur the wrath of yr wife, or parents... The Dumont organization came out w/their megabuck 30" "Royal Sovereign" console, but like so many other things that pushed the envelope, it was NOT a resounding success. They were VERY expensive, a lot went to hotels & bars, where they were run mercilessly, & they had quite a few"Inbred" problems w/the CRT. I think 1000 or so were initially made, they largely all failed, & another run of a 27" "Improved" replacement was done in 1951-52. Very few remain today, & I dunno of any working survivors w/either the 27" CRT or the original ginormous 30" jobs. Aren't you guys glad that you have a Crazee Bestid like ME who can remember all this weird, off the wall shyte like I do, & share it w/everyone ?!? Yeah, I know-Shut Daphck up, Big Boy, & slither back under that rock to Greater Bugtussle, we'll CALL you if we want you....

[bandersen]

If the price is reasonable and the chassis intact, I'd go for it. Factor in the cost of a replacement 10BP4 CRT. At least it has all the knobs.

As for repairing the holes. I'd try some wood filler and stain. You don;t need to steel strength of JB Weld. Plus you could remove the filler fairly easily if it doesn't look right. Colored wax or shellac filler stick is another option. Treat it like a damaged piece of wood furniture in other words.

[Tony F]

Hi guys, Thanks for all the comments. I knew that the picture tube was shot, so a replacement would be required. I like Bob's idea about the wood filler, and making it reversible. If I was to get only 1 of these sets, the cabinet being original would be high on my list. I think the seller is pretty convinced that it is extremely RARE and valuable. I might make an offer and leave it at that, letting him know the fatal flaws.
Tony

[WISCOJIM]

Originally Posted by Sandy G

The Dumont organization came out w/their megabuck 30" "Royal Sovereign" console, but like so many other things that pushed the envelope, it was NOT a resounding success. They were VERY expensive, a lot went to hotels & bars, where they were run mercilessly, & they had quite a few"Inbred" problems w/the CRT. I think 1000 or so were initially made, they largely all failed, & another run of a 27" "Improved" replacement was done in 1951-52. Very few remain today, & I dunno of any working survivors w/either the 27" CRT or the original ginormous 30" jobs. Aren't you guys glad that you have a Crazee Bestid like ME who can remember all this weird, off the wall shyte like I do, & share it w/everyone ?!?

I want to hear more about this 27-inch replacements in 1951-52. Would you please start a new thread about it? (Hate to be hijacking this Admiral thread)

.

[Sandy G]

Gosh, THAT goes back a way. I THINK I remember reading that in "The Cathode Ray Tube" book that was published a good 15, 20 yrs ago. It was only a little blurb about those humongous sets seems like they didn't have adequate getters and/or weren't Aluminumised which apparently affected their performance longevity as well. I'll hve to try to locate my copy of that book, dig it out & report back. I THINK the 27" replacements were much better than their big brothers were, didn't suffer from the same problems at all, or not nearly as bad. I DO remember seeing a pic of the 30s being made, there were 2 guys standing atop/next to one, all dressed to kill in those double-breasted suits w/those big "Peaked" lapels that were The Shit back then... they were obviously bigger sized guys, but another one could have fit next to them & the front of the CRT still wouldn't have been "Full".... I think that Allen B. Dumont & Co just simply didn't have the technical/engineering resources to pulloff an engineering feat like that huge tube. Reminded me of the DeHavilland Comet-The world's 1st jet airliner, from 1949... They went into service, the pride & hope of Great Britain's postwar aircraft industry, but started falling out of the sky. Turned out they used square cut windows, which "Worked" in pressurization & de-pressurization, developed miniscule cracks at the corners, & eventually caused an explosive decompression. Jets were BRAND-EW then, & so was, in a large part, pressurization, the Brits could be forgiven for trying to go w/a totally new & untried bunch of technologies... Pressurisation had been around for awhile, but it still wasn't understood very well. Same w/huge CRTs. At least, none of them ever exploded-But they hastened the eventual end of the Dumont co.

[Electronic M]

ISTR on (username M3STR8 aka) Lee's Royal Soverign CRT retrofit thread (forget if it was here and or ARF) someone mentioned there being some sort of factory issued retrofit kit for sets in the field with bad CRTs after they discontinued the IIRC 30BP4...If I was in your shoes Jim and happened to really want to use a Soverign with a dud tube I'd consider trying to implement Lee's solution...It seems the most practical one available.

[Sandy G]

Boys, I'll look for that book tomorrow. There's ANOTHER book I wanna look for "Behind the Tube" from '88 by a guy named Andrew Inglis, who had been a Big Dawg at RCA from practically the beginning of the Radio era, & was an even bigger dawg in the television days. I'm thinking it was perhaps a college textbook, it just had that look & feel to it, & had a lot more technical stuff than a general info book typically has. He was NOT too big a fan of General Sarnoff-But about everything I've read about Der General paints him as a pretty bad, mean, nasty SOB. Well, it takes one to know one, & I'm generally a nasty ol' SOB, too. So there.. (Grin)

[WISCOJIM]

Originally Posted by Electronic M

ISTR on (username M3STR8 aka) Lee's Royal Soverign CRT retrofit thread (forget if it was here and or ARF) someone mentioned there being some sort of factory issued retrofit kit for sets in the field with bad CRTs after they discontinued the IIRC 30BP4...If I was in your shoes Jim and happened to really want to use a Soverign with a dud tube I'd consider trying to implement Lee's solution...It seems the most practical one available.

Yes, Lee did a nice job with his conversion. But running a 30-inch round set with a 27-inch rectangular CRT in it doesn't interest me at all. It would be a novelty at best.

Right now I'm just trying to find anything that will lead me to any verifiable historical documentation of any replacement 27-inch that Sandy said was already done in 1951-52. I can't really imagine anything like that happening back at the time that 30BP4 CRTs were still available.

When did the first 27-inch CRT come out?

.

[Sandy G]

Again. I'm THINKIN' that the big boys RCA & Zenith had THEIR 27" CRTs by the early fifties. Pretty sure I've seen a picture of one-MAYBE a Zenith. IIRC, it had one of those "Not really rectangular, but not a Roundie either" style CRTs.That's one thing I despise about this hobby-Yet LOVE it at the same time. Virtually no written info exists about about stuff like this, save for grainy print ads. You can claim almost anything about the B/W sets of the day, all we have are fading memories, & precious else info. I know that in 1968-59, there was a push to make CRT screens lots more rectangular, kinda "Square 'em up" as it were. Interesting era....

[jr_tech]

Originally Posted by WISCOJIM

When did the first 27-inch CRT come out?

.

Peter Kellers book “The Cathode Ray Tube “ says the Rauland 27AP4 was announced anounced in 1952 and RCA produced a similar tube, the 27MP4 in 1953. These were both 90 degree metal cone rectangular tubes, I believe the 27AP4 was the first 27 rectangular CRT.

jr

[MadMan]

You could use black resin to fill the holes... might even be able to color match the bakelite, if you're good.