The elusive Indextron

[HelloVoltage]

the composite cable in post 170 of this thread should be disregarded. I used it in ignorance. The port into which it is inserted is much more complex, hence the thread I started here: http://www.videokarma.org/showthread.php?t=274650

[rcpilot23]

Originally Posted by HelloVoltage

if you mean watchcubes, have 9 working for a wall (3x3 array) project, can also possibly repair for you. If one of yours is white, would trade straight for a working black or working blue.

Mine are blue and black

[HelloVoltage]

expected. That white is a rare beast.

[jhalphen]

Hi to all,
Hi HelloVoltage,

Nice screen displays in your post #178, Congratulations! on getting it working.

What a collection of Indextrons! i'm impressed.
If you have time, it would be useful to know about the differences between the different XAV versions (50, 51...).

I have a XAV-U50, display unit only. Never powered it up as have no data on the multipin connector at the rear of unit.
Would you have identification of the pins or a schematic of the connection cable?
Guess it goes to the Diversity unit which i don't have.
Am hoping the display unit could be fed composite NTSC or RGB or VGA, whatever Sony decided to use.

Thanks! for any tips,

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France

[HelloVoltage]

jhalphen , what is the origin of the photo you provided in post 167? I mistakenly assumed that was your collection.

Never found any schematics, after trying to contact sony america and sony japan. May have also contacted sony singapore. There was likely some update/revision support so the service manuals must exist somehwhere. I search on japanese hobbyist sites sometimes , but have mostly just done repairs by repairing capacitor corroded trace, and looking at IC white pages and other service manuals for unilink devices from the time to try figure out how use the displays with no diversity unit present.
The cable that I found to be modifiable for test purposes is listed on ebay as Female MDR - Female MDR Camera Link Cable Frame Grabber Communications AIA
screenshot supplied

It does not have sufficient depth to make contact when the unit housing are on, or retaining tabs, so is it only suitable for testing with both display and diversity unit housings removed.
Will post the pinouts of the 26 pin connectors after determining if functionality is the same across all 3 models.
Been spending most focus on the xav-55n, as that extra power harness that allows for power up functionality with no diversity unit required, but no menu without the diversity unit. Also, the masking on the front bezel of the xav-u51 lacks the "diversity" mention as does the xav-55n, but lacks the extra harness present on the xav-55n. Having them all in a row on the bench will hopefully accelerate the fixes.

Also, just a weird UX note. The physical menu illumination has a choice of color between amber and green. Quirky.

edit. image as attachment is poor quality


double edit: archived JIC https://web.archive.org/web/20230117...m/121905099223

shameful triple edit: I just reread this multiple times because something looked off. The ebay listing mentions "11 shielded pairs". I don't recall that from when I purchased. I assume It would mean 22 of the 26 pins are shielded in a 26 pin cable, but one should specifically ask to make sure any cable received will be a 26 pin connector, just in case anything has changed. Also to make clear, there is no mirroring, the pinoutput and pininput of the double female mdr is the same as the sony cable for these indextrons. The difference is that 1-4 and 14-17 are bridged in the original cable, where all pins are individually connected in the MDR. This does not change functionality, as 1-4 is reserved for relayed 12v, and 14-17 is reserved for ground.

[jhalphen]

Hi to all,
Hi HelloVoltage,

Thanks! for your reply.
The photo posted in #167 is not from my collection, i have none in this type model. No Diversity unit, just the Indextron display box.
The photo was captured from Japanese auction site (now Buyee) attempting to get data on the XAV-U50 system.

I still believe Menus, etc. were generated by a RGB color generator, so the damn thing must have some RGB input data connections.

Your cable data is interesting, Thanks!, but too old to cope.

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/france

[HelloVoltage]

May I ask, what have you done to try to bring yours to life without a diversity unit present?
(i'm about to try something......if it works we will all feel foolish, but by the other hardware of the time.....)

[jhalphen]

Hi to all,
Hi HelloVoltage,

I've done absolutely nothing with the display unit since acquiring it.
Without any data, there was a total risk of destroying something so patiently waiting ever since.
I still think it's a data display with RGB or VGA inputs, unknown H & V scan rates.

Don't know if the NTSC decoding is in the display unit or the diversity companion, i would bet it's in the DiV box.

I have KX-370 working "Cube" Indextrons, so my curiosity about this display technology is satisfied.

Also our friend E-type2's site has a profusion of great Indextron screen pictures.

Will be watching with interest your planned experiment.

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France

[HelloVoltage]

I have 9 watchcubes. specifically fir to create an indextron (watchcube) video wall. I haven't found an appropriate (perfect) video for the project though. I do'nt want the presentation to use tubes removed from shells. But those margins.... I have not found an appropriate recording to spread across a margined wall.

[mbates14]

Seems as if Andy has deleted his entire presence here on this forum for some reason or another.

Anyways, has anyone fabricated up a replacement circuit for the CX22011 IC? they are basically unobtanium now and when I went to order one from aliexpress, they said no stock and wanted to charge some obscene amount.

So the only solution going forward is engineering up a replacement front-end for the SMPS side of the watchcube. Anyone ever cross this path yet?

[jhalphen]

Hi to All,
Hi Mbates14,

Found this illustration of the Sony CX22011 PWR control IC in my archives.
Unfortunately, spec sheet searches yield nothing and i've never had a full Sony data sheet, even in 2007.

Also, there is no Theory of Operation in the KVX-370 Service Manual so it's going to be a difficult task to assess what voltages & how many the CX22011 supplies.

Note: this parts search co. claims/MAY have a spec sheet but requires inscription (which i won't do):
https://www.jotrin.com/product/parts/CX22011

Sorry! not to be more helpful,

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France

[mbates14]

Originally Posted by jhalphen

Hi to All,
Hi Mbates14,

Found this illustration of the Sony CX22011 PWR control IC in my archives.
Unfortunately, spec sheet searches yield nothing and i've never had a full Sony data sheet, even in 2007.

Also, there is no Theory of Operation in the KVX-370 Service Manual so it's going to be a difficult task to assess what voltages & how many the CX22011 supplies.

Sorry! not to be more helpful,

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France

Yeah, that's all the same information I had and i could find as well. they are only using one of the two error amplifiers, and they aren't using the HV or LV shutdown protections in this design, either.

Also this chip appears to use a 1.2V reference, which there are very few PWM chips that do.

What cuts a lot of the market is the fact that they are using this in locked-frequency sync mode which again very few available chips can do. the SG3525 was attractive to do this, but it requires a modified feedback network due to the differences in reference voltage, and the other problem I ran into is its a push-pull design. I tried to sum the output using gates but it did not work well with the glitching and phase compensation issues.

I assume they phase-lock the 22011 power supply section for noise reasons, but they also pick off the R/C timing circuit ramp that runs off to the horizontal deflection stage to an extra winding on the yoke. idk if its a pincushion/horizontal parabola circuit or what.

So i put it aside for now, I did find a couple different ICs i can tinker with which have single-ended outputs and can phase-lock.

I attached the insanity that ensued haha. The picture is hard to see because the forum software is still expecting attachments stuck in 1992.

[jhalphen]

Hi to all,
Hi Mbates14,

Thanks! for the reply.
You have well analyzed the PWR circuitry and your engineering skills are far above mine.

Are you sure your CX22011 is dead; i sent one one of my Indextrons to Andy C. and it was a corroded trace under the IC (electrolytic leakage) which caused the PSU malfunction.

Andy left the VK forum for personal reasons.
He's on ARF (Antique Radio Forum) though and signs "AC".
Might still be willing to repair Indextrons.

see this thread for instance :
https://antiqueradios.com/forums/vie...?f=15&t=427760

Best Regards
jhalphen
Paris/France

[mbates14]

Oh its definitely dead, cap goo gets absorbed into the IC and kills it with no output. I just got into indextrons and I have been successful at fixing them with replacement CX22011s. But supply has run out unfortunately.

So its time to engineer a new solution to replace it.

[mbates14]

Actually i cant even log-in over there. I've been deactivated, and its due to not having a location in my account which actually rubs me the wrong way.

What is it of anyone's concern where I am located in an antique radio forum? Irrelevant information.

Anyways, I digress.