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  #31  
Old 08-12-2018, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MIPS View Post
Bumping the thread because here I am in Tokyo right now and I've made a discovery.

It totally slipped my mind that Japan still heavily uses fluorescent lighting everywhere and because there's no need to fix what ain't broke a lot of these lights use modern ballasts that still rely on starters. These ballasts support up to 4" 40w tubes which is exactly what I'm after even if the ballasts are rated for 100v 50hz.

New problem: I forgot that in 2015 the Japanese government announced the phaseout of incandescent and fluorescent lighting. It's not that by 2020 they will only have LED products available, it's that they have mandated that ALL lighting unless with exemption will be LED by 2020. The result is that while I can still find starters, sockets and tubes, tubes and the ballasts especially can no longer be imported or manufactured. I combed over akihabara and could not find a store that was still selling ballasts. Either you already had a spare or you were being asked to buy an LED replacement.
I think my only chance here now is if I came across a place that was selling used lamps or ballasts in the next week and a half, otherwise I'm back to googling and hoping.
I find that ironic. I'm 52 and I remember as a kid back in the 1970's, they were hawking fluorescent lighting was the "bee's knees" to saving energy vs. incandescent bulbs. I don't know how true this is, but my mother graduated high school in 1956, almost all the lighting was incandescent but when she entered the workforce at that time, fluorescent lights were becoming big in offices and she attributes that lighting to her needing glasses.
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  #32  
Old 08-27-2018, 08:50 PM
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Well I broke down and decided to see what exactly China might have. Perhaps there's factories out there that can wind ballasts for 110v?

Sure can.
Almost immediately I have multiple manufacturers and suppliers through Alibaba who can deliver the desired ballasts in minimum quantities as low as 10 units which is enough to do what I want. I will have to fire off a few RFQ's and see what they come back with for pricing and freight rates but this may turn out to be the way to go.

Last edited by MIPS; 09-06-2018 at 07:46 PM.
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  #33  
Old 09-06-2018, 07:46 PM
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Initial payment for your Trade Assurance order received

Dear [Mr MIPS],

The supplier has received your initial payment. You may contact the supplier to confirm the order's shipping. We will inform you when the supplier has shipped your products.

Initial payment amount: US $254.00
Order number: XXXXXXYYYYYYYZZZZZ
Hot DAMN I managed to secure a dozen units.

It comes out to something like $334CDN after shipping or equally $27.83 per ballast. Seems a bit pricey however our only other option remained "New old Stock" ballasts from ebay that are several decades old and are NOT PCB-free for $44.03CAD each after shipping. These new ballasts are PCB-free, assured to be good and they're pretty much doing a custom run to make them, so I get bragging rights on doing something insane.
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  #34  
Old 09-09-2018, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by MIPS View Post
Hot DAMN I managed to secure a dozen units.

It comes out to something like $334CDN after shipping or equally $27.83 per ballast. Seems a bit pricey however our only other option remained "New old Stock" ballasts from ebay that are several decades old and are NOT PCB-free for $44.03CAD each after shipping. These new ballasts are PCB-free, assured to be good and they're pretty much doing a custom run to make them, so I get bragging rights on doing something insane.
This is very interesting! I personally despise modern electronic florescent ballasts and now the switch mode modulated LED lighting fixtures anywhere near my basement workshop. The broadband hash they generate raises Cain with AM radio and TV reception. Who knows what affects they're having on our personal health.

Please post pictures and a full report when you receive them.
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  #35  
Old 09-10-2018, 03:13 AM
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Fluorescent lighting can affect you eyes. They could installed devices that would rise up the electric network frequency up to 200 Hz and eliminate that problem, but they didn't do it. Heck, it's good for me that still I don't have to put eyeglasses, 'cause I hate them.
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  #36  
Old 09-11-2018, 12:24 AM
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Fluorescent lighting is a very real hazard in workshops with rotating machinery. Due to strobe effects this can appear stationary or slow moving when it's not. In the UK the usual solution was 3 phase fittings or lead-lag fittings. Running tubes in sets of 3 from 3 phase increased the flicker rate from 100Hz to 300Hz which was sufficient with the phosphor persistence to solve the problem. Lead-lag fittings could be used where 3 phase wasn't available or practical. These used a mixture of L and C in the ballast to operate 2 tubes with something approaching the equivalent of 200Hz flicker.

HF ballasted fluorescents give a nice steady light and better efficiency than 50/60Hz. Now obsolete with the rise of LEDs.

Some LEDs using rectified mains have flicker that's as bad as fluorescents. Others use high frequency or smoothed DC and are safe with machinery. Then you often get radio interference from HF designs.
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  #37  
Old 09-11-2018, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by ppppenguin View Post

Some LEDs using rectified mains have flicker that's as bad as fluorescents. Others use high frequency or smoothed DC and are safe with machinery. Then you often get radio interference from HF designs.
I've yet to run across a shop type fixture that uses smoothed(filtered DC) here in the US. I would imagine that would kill the efficiency, although I would prefer a less efficient linear DC supply for area's where rf interference is critical. I suppose one could tare into the circuitry and modify the power supply to ones own liking.
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  #38  
Old 09-11-2018, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by ppppenguin View Post
Fluorescent lighting is a very real hazard in workshops with rotating machinery. Due to strobe effects this can appear stationary or slow moving when it's not. In the UK the usual solution was 3 phase fittings or lead-lag fittings. Running tubes in sets of 3 from 3 phase increased the flicker rate from 100Hz to 300Hz which was sufficient with the phosphor persistence to solve the problem. Lead-lag fittings could be used where 3 phase wasn't available or practical. These used a mixture of L and C in the ballast to operate 2 tubes with something approaching the equivalent of 200Hz flicker.

HF ballasted fluorescents give a nice steady light and better efficiency than 50/60Hz. Now obsolete with the rise of LEDs.

Some LEDs using rectified mains have flicker that's as bad as fluorescents. Others use high frequency or smoothed DC and are safe with machinery. Then you often get radio interference from HF designs.
All large areas that required a high degree of lighting used fluorescent light strips derived from a 3 phase source. In shopping centers and large stores, factories 480/277 was the common setup, one row of lights from each phase.
They seemed brighter from minimizing stroboscopic effect.
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  #39  
Old 09-11-2018, 10:15 PM
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One day my eyes just happened to glance up and notice a wire off on a utility pole next to our shop...I called the power company to let them know. (It didn't effect us.) Later the manager of the big warehouse next door came by to tell me that he'd been trying to figure out why (only) part of his lights wouldn't come on!
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  #40  
Old 09-14-2018, 10:36 PM
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And so our adventure finally ends with a (well rounded) box at the step this afternoon.







Was it worth it?
Each to their own!
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  #41  
Old 09-15-2018, 12:28 AM
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Whatever helps you stare blankly at the ceiling and happily say "damn it, I left the lights on" at night.
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  #42  
Old 09-15-2018, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by MIPS View Post
Hot DAMN I managed to secure a dozen units.

It comes out to something like $334CDN after shipping or equally $27.83 per ballast. Seems a bit pricey however our only other option remained "New old Stock" ballasts from ebay that are several decades old and are NOT PCB-free for $44.03CAD each after shipping. These new ballasts are PCB-free, assured to be good and they're pretty much doing a custom run to make them, so I get bragging rights on doing something insane.
The chances are almost 100% that this manufacturer, and almost every other manufacturer in China subscribes to Dr. P's philosophy "Lie, lie and lie some more".

If blindly handing one's resources over to China is considered insane, then most of Western society is.
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  #43  
Old 09-15-2018, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Jon A. View Post
The chances are almost 100% that this manufacturer, and almost every other manufacturer in China subscribes to Dr. P's philosophy "Lie, lie and lie some more".

If blindly handing one's resources over to China is considered insane, then most of Western society is.
If you are referring to the presence of PCB's, I'm not even sure where you would even need it in this, considering it's just a painted iron core transformer.

Edited: Also for this lamp housing at least I can say the new ballast at a glance sure looks a lot less likely to give me cancer.


Last edited by MIPS; 09-15-2018 at 03:46 PM.
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  #44  
Old 09-16-2018, 02:43 PM
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So have you measured the voltage at the lamp terminals? I'm wondering if there is some off the self part that would work?

I think the PCB's in old ballasts was contained in the oil inside a capacitor for the rapid start feature. I had a mid 60's sign ballast that popped one of those oil filled caps and boy what a mess. When they short they boil a mixture of tar and oil out of the ballast seams. Of course that ruined the reveres painting inside the sign face. Not sure if it contained PCB's but I had to clean up the huge mess none the less.

Last edited by Kevin Kuehn; 09-16-2018 at 02:50 PM.
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  #45  
Old 09-16-2018, 03:10 PM
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Blinkity blink blink video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjphxq9nUrA

Last edited by Kevin Kuehn; 09-16-2018 at 03:13 PM.
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