Help! What is this? Montgomery Ward Radio Info Needed - Videokarma.org TV - Video

Lightfoot · #1 06-20-2016, 12:32 PM

This belongs to my 80 year old neighbor who would like more information on this radio he received from his grandparents. He remembers it being in their home, but has never tried using it himself.

The inside cover has a paper with directions for connecting batteries and is marked Montgomery Ward Co. There are also a set of Newcomb headphones.
The inside components appear to be present and we'd like to know if it would be safe to try with batteries and if so, what type?

We would also appreciate any information on history, its use, model #, value or any links anyone can suggest that would lend more info on this piece.

Thank you in advance for any light that can be shed on this radio.
Rachelle

jr_tech · #2 06-20-2016, 03:02 PM

It would be helpful if you could post the tube number...hopefully it is etched/stamped on the side of the glass envelope or on the base. Nearly impossible to figure out operating voltages without specific knowledge of the tube number, unless somebody happens to recognize the set.

jr

Lightfoot · #3 06-20-2016, 05:09 PM

I see nothing marked on the side of tube and am a little nervous to pull it out as it doesn't give easily (not sure if I turn or lift straight up) The top of the tube is marked RCA, but that probably doesn't help much. The paper label has the numbers 12043 and on the inside another part says Rheostat pat. no. 85? or 35? Sorry I don't know much about these things, but thank you for your help.

Bill R · #4 06-20-2016, 05:26 PM

Interesting that it shows the A battery and B battery connected to the same point. That can't be right, can it?

init4fun · #5 06-20-2016, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lightfoot

Thank you in advance for any light that can be shed on this radio.
Rachelle

Hi Rachelle ,

Your radio will need a couple of things if it's ever to play again . First as you already know is batteries . While the common B battery size was 45 volts (with multiple batteries used on multi tube radios , 2 batteries in series being 90 volts , 3 being 135 volts , and so on) the A battery will differ depending on tube type , not every tube has the same filament (heater) voltage . That's why JR wanted the tube number which is likely embossed on the tube base . To remove your tube you turn it counterclockwise by maybe an inch to disengage the metal pin seen in one of your side view shots of the tube in it's socket , then lift it out . Your radio will also need both a long wire antenna , outside the house if there are no local AM radio stations where you are , and a ground connection . In the old days folks used to ground them to a copper water pipe because those were all grounded , but with today's use of PVC piping even for water supply there is no 100% certainty of any metal pipe being actually grounded and so a ground rod is the best bet . Lastly ,providing the tube is actually good , your batteries are in order , and your antenna and ground requirements are met , you'll need something to listen to your radio with in the form of a set of headphones . Your radio has no internal speaker and being a one tube design it doesn't have the power to drive a speaker so a period correct set of headphones are what will be used to turn the radio signals into sounds you can hear . This is why many of these end up as nicely polished display pieces on a shelf somewhere rather than in actual use because usually it's only us radio collectors who will go to the lengths required to get one to run .

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill R

Interesting that it shows the A battery and B battery connected to the same point. That can't be right, can it?

Hi Bill ,

I think they took some liberties with the drawing and a quick look at the tube in one of the other pictures shows the two different wires going to two different pins on the tube socket (VS the drawing showing them both on the same pin) . In actual application it's not unusual to see the batteries negative sides tied together to form a common return point for both the heater and plate voltages , with a switch in the - going wires acting as the power switch .

Lightfoot · #6 06-20-2016, 07:02 PM

Init4fun-

Thank you so much for the wealth of information!

I just got the tube out, it is marked RCA Radiotron UV199

Now that I know what is needed, I will see if he wants to attempt to get it going. There is a set of Newcomb headphones with it, however I'm embarrassed to ask but... where do they plug in?
Not sure if you can tell from the picture of the headphones, but the ends do not seem to me to have anywhere on the radio to go, though I'm sure they must - I'm just wondering where?

Thanks again!

jr_tech · #7 06-20-2016, 07:25 PM

The uv-199 has a 3 volt filament, So a couple of D sized flashlight batteries in series should work fine. I have never seen a rectangular 3 volt battery with clip connections like the chart appears to show.

Are there 2 binding posts on the bottom left of the picture of the front panel for the headphone connection?

jr

init4fun · #8 06-20-2016, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lightfoot

Init4fun-

Thank you so much for the wealth of information!

I just got the tube out, it is marked RCA Radiotron UV199

Now that I know what is needed, I will see if he wants to attempt to get it going. There is a set of Newcomb headphones with it, however I'm embarrassed to ask but... where do they plug in?
Not sure if you can tell from the picture of the headphones, but the ends do not seem to me to have anywhere on the radio to go, though I'm sure they must - I'm just wondering where?

Thanks again!

Hi Rachelle ,

I'm happy you got the tube out and yes indeed , the 199 was a very common type used in the single tube radios . The reason I mentioned a "period correct" set of headphones is that I had thought (mistakenly) that the Newcomb brand was newer than your radio , but looking at the picture again I see that those are indeed from the right era to belong to that radio . The ends of the wires will go under the little screw terminals on the left front of the radio . the black one on top and the silver one on the bottom will unscrew a ways (also counterclockwise) to reveal a hole where the pin on the wire will go , and then tighten down the terminal to hold the pin in place . The great thing about it being a one tube set is that if you do decide to try to get it to work you won't need too many batteries compared to , for instance a 6 tube battery operated set , those can get somewhat pricey to provide batteries for . In fact , a lot of folks with the multiple tube battery sets will run them off of modern day designed and built power supplies that work with regular house electricity so they can be run regularly without the $pendy batteries ....

EdKozk2 · #9 06-21-2016, 12:30 AM

Hi Rachelle,
In addition to all the good information given you, I'll throw in my two cents.
You most likely have a regenerative reciever. Many of those old 1920's battery sets used two 22 1/2 volt batteries to come up with 45 volts total for the "B" supply. The lower voltage can help to reduce howling and squealing in the head phones when listening. With a good antenna your type of radio should even work with about 24 volts for the "B" supply. I have been able to go as low as 16 volts, just for testing.
Ed

jr_tech · #10 06-21-2016, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jr_tech

The uv-199 has a 3 volt filament, So a couple of D sized flashlight batteries in series should work fine. I have never seen a rectangular 3 volt battery with clip connections like the chart appears to show.

If there is a rheostat on the front panel (like a volume control) it is likely that the radio used a 4-1/2 volt battery for the filament and adjusted it for correct filament voltage. This would allow adjustment as the battery wore out, as well as serving as a volume control, by adjusting the filament voltage below 3 volts if the station was too loud. Retangular 4-1/2 volt batteries were readily available at the time.
Found this ad for a uv199... very expensive at the time! The magazine provides an interisting glimpse into radio in the era when the radio was new.

http://www.vacuumtubeera.net/RadioBr...03-1923-09.pdf

jr

Lightfoot · #11 06-21-2016, 11:07 AM

Init4fun, Jr. & Ed-

Thanks again for all the info. you've been so very helpful!

Someone told me this was a kit...is that accurate & if so does anyone know the time frame it would've sold or about what it would have originally cost his grandparents to purchase? I know he's told me that they were farmers and money was scarce.

Not sure what he will want to do with it, but I'm excited to tell him what I've learned. If we can get it to work I will post results.

Thanks again for your knowledge & time.
Rachelle

Lightfoot · #12 06-21-2016, 11:11 AM

Jr. Oh my gosh that's great...thank you!!

I didn't see your post and link before my last post. I will get to reading it....looks like it might answer my last questions!

jr_tech · #13 06-21-2016, 03:58 PM

Found a somewhat similar radio on the 'Bay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SMALL-ANTIQU...-/172241564278

jr

earlyfilm · #14 06-21-2016, 04:12 PM

Lightfoot,

To see what the UV199 is, go to:

https://frank.pocnet.net/sheetsU.html

and down load the PDF for the tube.

It also shows a typical circuit.

James.

Lightfoot · #15 06-21-2016, 06:16 PM

Hey Guys-

Thanks for the last few links as well as all the extremely helpful information you've ALL provided...a knowledgeable bunch here!

I started with no clue about any of this and now feel like I have a better sense of it from everything that's been provided....probably going to have dreams tonight of being chased by UV199 tubes, antennas and batteries!

Thanks again!!
Rachelle