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Old 06-22-2018, 05:07 PM
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How much a second-hand portable 35 m.m. projector costed in the '80's?

How much a second-hand portable 35 m.m. projector costed in the '80's? I've seen that very big screen tv sets (+40") costed at least 13,000-15,000 U.S. Dollars in that era's money. An second-hand 35 m.m. portable movie projector was cheaper?
How good where the C.R.T. video projectors back then?
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Old 06-23-2018, 09:45 PM
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I never heard of a portable or consumer grade 35mm film projector. Only 16mm.

CRT video projectors always suffered from low contrast, gradually improving as optics were refined. Front screen projectors suffered both from flare in the lenses and reflection of room light. The reflection of room light was reduced quite a bit by the highly directional reflective screens. Rear projectors also suffered from lens flare, but reflected room light less.

Some lenses even had baffles built in to absorb tangential rays, while allowing the axial rays to go through. Digital mirror devices, with their much smaller lens apertures, had much less flare than CRT projectors, but also had a minimum reflectance that decreased contrast. This was improved with later chip designs.
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Old 06-24-2018, 09:29 AM
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And how much did a 16 m.m. costed versus a big screen tv set? Could you rented movies on 16 m.m. in the '80's?
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:01 AM
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You're off by about a factor of 5 on the price of a projection TV in the 80's. They were closer to $2000-$3000 in the 80's.

Movies were available on 16mm, but they weren't intended for home use. Schools could rent them, but I'm not sure what they cost. 16mm projectors weren't cheap (probably almost as much as a projection TV) and few people would want a noisy projector in their living room, or have to change reels during the movie.

I didn't know anyone with a TV bigger than 27" until the 90's, and even then 32" was a luxury item. 19"-27" were the most common sizes for the family TV back then.
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:32 AM
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You need to find some home film enthusiasts to answer the questions about film movie availability, but I'm very sure it was a tiny fraction of what was available on VHS tape, and they were not contemporary films. I would guess a 16mm sound projector would have cost some hundreds of dollars, under $1,000, but I don't really know. Mass distribution of 16 mm film was not economical because of both the copy cost and the wear and tear during use, requiring frequent replacement. VCR tapes were much more durable and user friendly.

16mm Hollywood entertainment films were used for syndication to TV stations. With the advent of professional video tape, distribution on film stopped in favor of professional format tapes, which no one could play at home. As the film libraries were bought up by Ted Turner and others, the only consumer outlet became VHS tape or broadcast and cable TV.
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Old 06-24-2018, 12:06 PM
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Have you ever seen the inner workings of a 35mm based theatre? It's quite a big collection of equipment. First of all, you need two projectors, because a 2000 foot reel gets you only about 20 minutes of run time. Movies usually come on 5 or more such reels, and you need to have a projectionist seamlessly switch between projectors as the movie plays.

Speaking of projectors, fire code requires all film projection rooms for over 16mm film need to have separate ventilation to the outdoors, and be fire proof.

Then there's the cost of film, a single 35mm movie would cost thousands to buy, and that's if you can get it - most were just leased to theatres.

Basically what it all comes down to, is 35mm theatres in homes are restricted to the super rich movie executives and actors in California, who can spend half a million to build the theatre and then hire a projectionist to run the whole thing, or extremely resourceful hobbyists.

16mm is much more practical at home, but it was also more common in institutional/educational settings. The reality is that video brought movies at home to the masses in a way film never could. Also keep in mind that running film means knowing how to handle and splice film, and takes a certain amount of skill. It is not plug and play like video.
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Old 06-24-2018, 08:58 PM
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About 15 or 20 years ago I met a fellow at the flea market who was a dumpster-diver. He had scored a bunch of old movies from the 40's-50's on 16mm that were discarded by the public library. To that point I had no idea that you could ever get them from a library. I'd seen one or two movies on 16mm in school but they were very old b/w films, geared towards kids.
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Old 06-24-2018, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxhifi View Post
Have you ever seen the inner workings of a 35mm based theatre? It's quite a big collection of equipment. First of all, you need two projectors, because a 2000 foot reel gets you only about 20 minutes of run time. Movies usually come on 5 or more such reels, and you need to have a projectionist seamlessly switch between projectors as the movie plays.
The theaters I worked in in the early 1970's had already done away with that primitive technology, just as we did with the carbon arc light source. By 1973 all our theaters had switched to single projector automated systems with the 5 or 6 reels all spliced together on a single platter. They were operated by the ushers and doorman, no dedicated "projectionist" was needed.

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Old 06-24-2018, 11:54 PM
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Originally Posted by WISCOJIM View Post
The theaters I worked in in the early 1970's had already done away with that primitive technology, just as we did with the carbon arc light source. By 1973 all our theaters had switched to single projector automated systems with the 5 or 6 reels all spliced together on a single platter. They were operated by the ushers and doorman, no dedicated "projectionist" was needed.

.
Fair enough, but in a theatre where you plan to show each film only once, and then switch to another movie, setting up a platter would be very time consuming.
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Old 06-25-2018, 05:32 AM
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There where portable (or at least smaller) 35 m.m. projectors. They camed with one when I was in kindergarten. And I've seen somwehere a manual for one.
Here are images with 35 m.m. portable film (movie) projectors: http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/p...860&category=1
http://www.hallucine.fr/en/rental-sa...nema-material/
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Old 06-25-2018, 05:39 AM
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Fair enough, but in a theatre where you plan to show each film only once, and then switch to another movie, setting up a platter would be very time consuming.
It is much less time consuming with the platter system, even if showing a film only once.

Running the reels onto the platter takes about a half hour, teardown about the same. That's one-hour labor total to set up and teardown per movie. Then the projector is run automatically through the show after being started by the doorman/usher/manager (select one), so no one needs to be in the booth while a show is being run. There are multiple platters on the stacking unit so that you can have multiple movies set up and ready to show back-to-back. You can set up or teardown movies on platters even while running shows off different platters.

If you used separate projectors for reel switchovers you then need a dedicated person to be in the booth the entire length of the film, as well as an additional projector (not cheap). With the platter system you could have the doorman easily teardown one movie and get a new one on a platter while a show is running, so in fact NO extra labor hours were needed to run the projectors.

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Old 06-25-2018, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telecolor 3007 View Post
There where portable (or at least smaller) 35 m.m. projectors. They camed with one when I was in kindergarten. And I've seen somwehere a manual for one.
Here are images with 35 m.m. portable film (movie) projectors: http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/p...860&category=1
http://www.hallucine.fr/en/rental-sa...nema-material/
You learn something new every day!
All the school room projectors here were 16mm sound.
High schools had a large auditorium where the professional type 35mm were used for certain uses. They still used the carbon-arc light source.
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Old 06-25-2018, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Telecolor 3007 View Post
There where portable (or at least smaller) 35 m.m. projectors. They camed with one when I was in kindergarten. And I've seen somwehere a manual for one.
Here are images with 35 m.m. portable film (movie) projectors: http://www.film-tech.com/warehouse/p...860&category=1
http://www.hallucine.fr/en/rental-sa...nema-material/
Comments:

1) The first picture (two MP-30s) deos not show the take up reels. I presume they must be under the table.
2) There would be no place in the US where it would be legal to use these with nitrate film due to fire regulations, thereby limiting the availability of old films
Edit: of course, I mean as portable in ordinary rooms. Fire regulations would allow use in a fire-proof booth.
3) The projectors in the second page look like they are portable only by truck, too big to be considered for home use.

http://www.matthewwagenknecht.com/th...costs-of-film/
cost of film only (not including printing)
New from Kodak $863 per 1000’ roll (11 minutes)
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Last edited by old_tv_nut; 06-25-2018 at 11:42 AM.
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Old 06-25-2018, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by old_tv_nut View Post
Comments:

1) The first picture (two MP-30s) deos not show the take up reels. I presume they must be under the table.
2) There would be no place in the US where it would be legal to use these with nitrate film due to fire regulations, thereby limiting the availability of old films
Edit: of course, I mean as portable in ordinary rooms. Fire regulations would allow use in a fire-proof booth.
3) The projectors in the second page look like they are portable only by truck, too big to be considered for home use.

http://www.matthewwagenknecht.com/th...costs-of-film/
cost of film only (not including printing)
New from Kodak $863 per 1000’ roll (11 minutes)
I can see them being legal if used outdoors in the open for a film in the park type of event.
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Old 06-25-2018, 03:09 PM
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I can see them being legal if used outdoors in the open for a film in the park type of event.
Well, aside from legal or not, movie projectors are very noisy and hot. Having even a 16mm projector in the screening room is really a compromise. Between the clacking of the intermittent mechanism, the whir of the motor, and the air blasting through the lamp house, they really deserve to be in their own room.

Don't get me wrong, I love watching movies on film, but ideally very far from the projector
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