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  #31  
Old 07-26-2017, 05:32 PM
tom.j.fla tom.j.fla is offline
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Timmy, you will find at the ETF scans of folders 55-16 and 71-12 which are the TS-4 series chassis. They have a voltage and resistance charts with in. They also have 83-6 which is the TS-18 that is like the-4j late chassis with the same charts as the other two.
All the best, Tom.J
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  #32  
Old 07-26-2017, 06:11 PM
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I have voltage charts for the ts18 and another one but there are little changes that I'm not sure if the 4 j would be the same, like production changes which I already found with the 4j. But I'll take alook anyway.

Last edited by timmy; 07-26-2017 at 06:30 PM.
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  #33  
Old 07-28-2017, 12:41 PM
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I'm wondering if this set had problems with vert roll many years earlier because when I got this set c140 was not there but rather a .001 600 v was tacked in its place, and not factory soldered then I discovered that c140 was not there so I replaced it after removing the .001 which clearly someone put it there to try to fix something and the cap was a black sprague , an old one done many years earlier. The ts18 tubes for the I f are different then the 4j so the voltages may not be the same. Maybe a ts4d would be closer because it uses the same tubes for the I f. I can't find any info as far as voltage or resistance chart for even the ts4d on ETF maybe someone can let me know where to look to find it.

Last edited by timmy; 07-28-2017 at 12:46 PM.
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  #34  
Old 07-28-2017, 01:48 PM
tom.j.fla tom.j.fla is offline
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Ok Timmy, The voltage & resistance charts are in the SAMS folder them self. Sams 55-16 print page 14, pdf page 19_ Sams 71-12 print page 8 & pdf page 8 and Sams 83-6 print page 8 & pdf page 11. Tom.J
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  #35  
Old 07-30-2017, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom.j.fla View Post
Ok Timmy, The voltage & resistance charts are in the SAMS folder them self. Sams 55-16 print page 14, pdf page 19_ Sams 71-12 print page 8 & pdf page 8 and Sams 83-6 print page 8 & pdf page 11. Tom.J
Ok the only SAMs I find that has a voltage and resistance chart is for the ts18 and I can't use it tube lineup is different and almost certain the voltages are different based on what I seen already on the ts4j compared to the voltage chart of the ts18. So if there is a listing for the 4d or the 4j voltage chart I can't find it.
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  #36  
Old 07-30-2017, 07:41 PM
tom.j.fla tom.j.fla is offline
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Ok, question where did you get your copy of SAMS 55-16 & 71-12 from. My pdf copies came from the ETF & the charts are on the pages I listed. Tom.J : )
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  #37  
Old 07-30-2017, 09:41 PM
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I got the SAMs for the ts18 from ETF and that one was the only one with the complete schematic. The others for the 4d and the 4j is only the schematic nothing else is there.
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  #38  
Old 07-31-2017, 09:58 AM
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Sounds like you click on the link to just the schematics. Look for VT-71 and VT-73 on the ETF site.

Link to Sams 55-16: http://www.earlytelevision.org/pdf/M...Sams-55-16.pdf

Link to Sams 71-12: http://www.earlytelevision.org/pdf/M...Sams-71-12.pdf
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  #39  
Old 08-01-2017, 04:05 PM
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Thankyou for these prints as I don't know why I could not have found these. The 4j is late and the other while seemingly the same the voltages are infact difference then those of each other as well as the ts18 voltages so I should be able to come up with some reason why it appears the b+ is low or being dragged down. Pin 6 of v11 shows 120vdc on the one schematic but the other schematic late ts4j shows 82 Vdc volts but yet same tube and yet 100 Vdc on the 25l6 audio tube, it makes no sense to me how can there be 82 Vdc on v11 and 100 Vdc on the audio tube they are wired in parallel so they should have the same voltage.

Last edited by timmy; 08-01-2017 at 04:20 PM.
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  #40  
Old 08-01-2017, 04:55 PM
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Did you see the note at the bottom of the voltage chart ?

V11 pin 6 is connected to pin 4 of v10 (audio tube) and should be the same voltage with respect to B-

The voltages on V11 are measured with respect to V11 pin 6. So pin 6 is 0 volts while V11 pin 5 is 82 volts with respect to pin 6.
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  #41  
Old 08-01-2017, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bandersen View Post
Did you see the note at the bottom of the voltage chart ?

V11 pin 6 is connected to pin 4 of v10 (audio tube) and should be the same voltage with respect to B-

The voltages on V11 are measured with respect to V11 pin 6. So pin 6 is 0 volts while V11 pin 5 is 82 volts with respect to pin 6.
Which SAMs are you referring to, 55 16 or the other SAMs. I was measuring the b+ from the positive to the negative I don't see where it shows pin 5 is 82 Vdc the only place I'm getting 82 Vdc is on pin 6 of v11 to common negative. Ok I see what you mean but pin 6 has b+ on it to neg is only 82vdc and should be 125 Vdc but the SAMs shows zero on pin 6 but the other SAMs says 120 Vdc. B+ is on the audio tube and v11 pin 6 . I'm just trying to figure out which SAMs to go by.

Last edited by timmy; 08-01-2017 at 06:37 PM.
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  #42  
Old 08-02-2017, 09:54 AM
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Yes, 0 on pin 6 with respect to pin 6. See the cross symbol next to the '0V' on the chart ?

What that means is but the negative lead of your meter on pin 6, not the common negative while taking that reading. So naturally when you also put the positive lead of your meter on pin 6, you will get 0 volts.

I think looking at the contrast control is the easiest way to tell.

The early TS-4J is just a standard three terminal pot.
The TS-4J late has two extra taps and several capacitors mounted on the pot.
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  #43  
Old 08-02-2017, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bandersen View Post
Yes, 0 on pin 6 with respect to pin 6. See the cross symbol next to the '0V' on the chart ?

What that means is but the negative lead of your meter on pin 6, not the common negative while taking that reading. So naturally when you also put the positive lead of your meter on pin 6, you will get 0 volts.

I think looking at the contrast control is the easiest way to tell.

The early TS-4J is just a standard three terminal pot.
The TS-4J late has two extra taps and several capacitors mounted on the pot.
Ok the contrast tells, it's early. So if I am to put meter neg on pin 6 then what is positive ? Because positive to pin 6 comes right from b+ Capacitor positive. Well the SAMs, early shows infact pin 6 has 120 Vdc on it so pin 6 to negative should be that of 120 Vdc but it don't . The other SAMs shows zero volts checking the way it says. It don't show any other negative to use, no stars or marks on the SAMs which I would think it's common , on the early SAMs.

Last edited by timmy; 08-02-2017 at 10:31 AM.
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  #44  
Old 08-02-2017, 10:36 AM
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Use Sams 55-16 then. Forget about using pin 6 for reference - that was only for Sams 71-12.

All voltages in Sams 55-16 are with respect to common.

Now that you have the correct service info, go through and check all the voltages and try to narrow down the problem.
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  #45  
Old 08-02-2017, 12:13 PM
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The contrast control matches mine with the 55-16 SAMs so yes now I'll go over it now that I have something to reference, and thanks for finding these SAMs. I really curious what could pull the b+ down from 125 Vdc to 82 Vdc sometimes 90 Vdc.
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