Bought my second car this week!

[Username1]

Always entertaining to hear about your auto-adventures ! I hate Chiltons books
for cars. I had one, and once I got the real book from the dealer I never again
got a chiltons for anything. Once I get a car, I immediately begin searching ebay
until I find one for the new car. By the time I need it, I usually find one at a good price.

Your air suspension compressor may or may not be bad, I would test it and the
sensors associated with it before just replacing it. There are lots of videos on youtube
about the air suspension, and the compressor does not seem to be the star of those
videos. I have known a number of people with air leveling suspension, most have
also gone to real spring replacement kits. It seems the air "bags" as they are called
seem to be the biggest problems.

My dad had it on our '87 LTD wagon, it always worked very well, and never failed.
On that car the compressor was under the hood with the engine, always warm and
dry.......

It may be worth a trip to the salvage yard to get the correct fittings from an
unmolested car, I wouldn't want that super glued fitting to come apart on me in
sub-zero weather. I don't trust super glue, I try and use epoxy, and liquid metal,
and other epoxy's with the word weld, or metal in the name. They are pretty good,
and seem to be temperature stable.

It looks like you have a few salvage years where they still let you in and do your
own parts pulls, If so that's great. I don't have that anymore here. I would just
take a small battery from a security system backup or garden tractor and get
a air pump off a similar vehicle, tested first of course.

Good Luck.


.

[Electronic M]

Yeah, I've been thinking about seeking a maker service manual.

I did attempt to test the compressor (hooked main power to a battery and nothing happened) only I don't know if it is a smart or dumb compressor....You see in addition to the 2 hefty red and black power wires on the main connector there is about 4-6 much smaller ones....I don't know if those are for valve solenoids or maybe some unknown internal relay in the pump...The pump has a second electrical connector with three fine wires that I believe goes to the accessory inflation port switch/indicator in the vehicle cabin.
If the pump was only 2 wires I could say for certain that it is dead, but without a wiring/schematic diagram of the system I just don't know enough about how electrically it is supposed to work to properly troubleshoot it.

That fitting I glued is aftermarket (no finding that in a salvage yard)....When the pump died they chopped the air lined to the bags off of the pump, then the took the lines from the bags and attached them to a plastic compression/rubber O-ring based 'T' fitting where the bottom leg of the T is a tire inflation nozzle. I've seen super glue do a good job of holding plastic together and it only needs to last till spring.

I may get the replacement air suspension parts from a salvage yard. IIRC there are pull your part yards near by....Never been in a salvage yard before though. I wanted to go to one for parts for the Lincoln, but could not find one with an applicable parts car....Seems most yards around here don't keep stuff over 20 years old....There should be hope for salvage yard parts for the Envoy though...I still see a lot of them on the road. I'm not going to a salvage yard till spring though...Today is likely the last moderately hospitable one for that this year, and I only have one winter coat that needs to stay nice-ish for work.

Thanks.

[Electronic M]

About a week ago I fixed the brakes myself...

Started last week tuesday. I ground the caliper bracket bolt head down (with a rotary Dremel) till I could hammer the next socket size down (11/16 IIRC) onto it. I made sure it was a darn snug fit, then took a breaker bar to it. I kept the socket on the bolt at all times till it was out...After that, the brake work on that side was cake, and I went to the other side.

I had to (gently ) sledge hammer that wheel off after the bolts were off since the wheel/hub/rotor had gotten rather stuck to each other (penetrating oil and kicking did nothing). I took all the lessons from the first wheel and applied them to the second, and I was able to get all the bolts off. Better yet even though one slider pin was getting rather sticky I was able to get the slider pins out, cleaned and re-greased.

I almost had it together when I hit a snag the pads did not want to go in. I concluded the spring clips on that side were bad, and the next day got replacements....Granted the parts store gave me the wrong ones at first (so I had to go back with the originals). With that I got the rear brakes done.



The results were interesting. The passenger side had an intermittent grind...After trying a couple of things I decided to try setting and releasing the E-brake, and that seems to have cured it.

The drive where I found the grind was rather disappointing though...At the end the air suspension which held level PERFECTLY for a week dropped and upon parking it I could hear an air hiss.....The next day after messing with the grind I filled it with air, grabbed a spray bottle of water and went leak hunting. The problem, much to my chagrin, was partially the fault of carelessness on my part. Apparently when I installed that T fitting the plastic air line under the car moved out of place and alighted on the exhaust pipe ....Luckily only a small hole resulted.



I tried to super glue the hole*, but came to realize the stuff never 'dries' in the cold. So I tried warming it with a lighter and promptly set the drop of glue on fire...Who knew super glue was flammable I blew it out (heat may have melted the plastic sealed) and retried keeping the flame farther away. Once dry I tested for leaks (none found), slathered it with Permatex red silicone and wrapped that with heat shrink tubing cut with a spiral from end to end so it would wrap the line securely. I followed up on recurrence prevention by taking some aluminum POTS wire and tying the line away from the exhaust...I may add more tiebacks.

* I made sure to de-presureise the system so leaking air would not blow the glue away...In fact I drew a slight vacuum (what my lungs are capable of making) on the line to draw the glue in.

The results: It has held air for almost a week and survived 2 work commutes.
I found a nice folding table for swap meets at a thrift yesterday too.

[Electronic M]

First big snow occurred over the weekend so yesterday I decided to test the 4WD....There are 5 settings for the 4WD transfer case 2Hi, AWD, 4Hi, 4Lo, and Neutral.

I put it in AWD mode* and got it half way to work on the poorest cleared road segments and the fastest segment (~70 on the highway) and all was well. Then I took off from a light and suddenly it was dragging the proverbial anchor...I was giving it enough gas to go 60-80 and it did not want to go over 35-40, and was squeaking and grinding. I have not read enough of the manual to know if it is only safe to make transfer case shifts in park so I kept it in AWD until the next light.... Before I got there it loosened up a good bit (when it did break loose there was some horizontal shimmy akin to brake steer) and I got up to the 50-55 traffic was moving, but it was still not happy so I went back to 2Hi (that it has been in most of the time I've had it).
Back in 2Hi all was normal.

*I'm fairly sure AWD mode defaults to RWD until the rear wheels slip then the front engages.

That evening on my way home I decided to try 4Hi (which I believe is constant 4WD) and wondered if it was stiff from disuse, and wanted to see if it was the forward gear or the AWD system that was acting up. I shifted it into 4Hi and drove about 4 blocks. It was not really improving, and I was REALLY dragging an anchor. Grinding was more pronounced, and as soon as I let off the gas, pretty good braking action without touching the brake occurred.

I've noticed before all this that in 2Hi mode that the front occasionally will grind a bit on sharp-ish turns (which I initially guessed was brake related).

I think there is some problem in the front differential or it's linkage to the wheels... Unless it is a cheap shop fix, or really easy I think I'll keep it in 2Hi until spring.

[Findm-Keepm]

If you want I can scan the TSBs for 4WD problems/solutions - lemme know. I have access to the whole Chiltons Library, courtesy of 22 years in the Navy....gotta love those bennies.

[Electronic M]

Originally Posted by Findm-Keepm

If you want I can scan the TSBs for 4WD problems/solutions - lemme know. I have access to the whole Chiltons Library, courtesy of 22 years in the Navy....gotta love those bennies.

That is a nice offer, and I'll be happy to read them (and eventually use them) if posted, but odds are I'm not going to do anything about it for a while, and I don't want to ask you to waste your time...It's 11 degrees outside currently and likely to remain bitter cold for the next month or two....I'm the kinda guy that don't want to stay outside longer than it takes to get the car jacked off the ground when temps drop below 38.

The check engine light came on again with the same sensor code, and one regarding the coolant recently....Crap I need to remember to check coolant level.

[Eric H]

The grinding shuddering sounds like the traction control might be kicking in for some reason. different sized tires will cause problems for some electronically controlled AWD systems, as will a bad wheel or driveshaft speed sensor.

The shift motors are a problem on the GM trucks, the internal potentiometer goes bad and it can't tell what range it's in.

[quaddriver]

GM front axles use essentially a cv or double cardan joint and it could be bad, or the propellor shaft from the xfer case to the axle could have a bad u joint. these are easy fixes ranging from fairly cheap ($15 u joint) to moderate ($100 cv)

Since the mechanical cacophony only occurs in 4/AWD it points to something that rotates only when the system is engaged. It would be hard for me to describe how to fix it here, pictures are worth a 1000 words and there are quite a few you tube videos on the repairs.

the entire system is a close, inbred cousin of the system used for the old S10 blazer, married to the Olds Bravada AWD system.

They have fleas, but they are fixable fleas.

do you have access to a garage and/or a lift? you need the wheels off the ground so you can grab hold of drive shafts and look. Id like to suggest you need a proper brake pin/balljoint/u joint on-car press tool (essentially a giant c-clamp) but you can get by with good sockets and big hammers.

and I know you like doing this stuff yourself but a word of caution, if you can lift up the majority of your tools at once, you aint got the right tool - so proceed with caution. when working ok, these systems are quite competent.

[Dude111]

Good for you buddy,she looks nice!!!!!

[Electronic M]

Twas in the 60's this weekend (positively tropical for Milwaukee in January) so I decided to replace the thermostat. Other VK members in another thread astutely pointed out that the heater and temp gauge symptoms I was talking about pointed to the thermostat being defective. In addition to the the heater and the temp gauge staying well below designed temp on days below 30F, on the warm Friday commute (55F) temp gauge reached operating temp, the heater was able to deliver comparatively (to cold days) nuclear warmth, and the check engine light turned it's self off....Good confirmation.

In this truck the thermostat is a permanent part of it's housing which is bolted to the side of the block in a well buried location.
Text book procedure is to pull the belt and alternator (see video below), but I wanted to avoid that and mess with as few systems at once as feasible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no9jVh4JyyM
Then I found another video which shows how to sneak in to get it through the wheel well...Probably requires twice the coordination/dexterity but a VERY good method.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Le18lv3W67A
Saturday afternoon I got it up on a jack stand pulled the driver's side front wheel, and checked access. I first got both bolts loose (to make sure this method could work) then pulled the bottom radiator hose (no drain plug avail) to drain the fluid. I was able to use the hose to get the old thermostat out. I then compared my part from O'riley's and noticed it was not made to restrict flow when closed any better then the old stuck open one....I re-consulted the first video parts compare and concluded the replacement was bad. I drove to another O'riley and compared the first replacement to the second...Same problem. I then went to the Advanced Auto a block away and asked to look at one of theirs...The part from Advanced was actually CLOSED PROPERLY in the cool closed position. I bought it on the spot, then returned O'riley's part and informed the clerk of the issue.
Back home I put the new one on the hose in as close to the same rotational position on the hose as I could and fished it back to the mount point on the block with the hose (the reverse of how I extracted the original), and went on a hunt for the two mount bolts that got dropped. Found one and gave up on the other. I got an two bolts that were a near exact matches and 3 others that would definitely work at the hardware store. I lost one trying to get it threaded on. I got the bottom bolt on and had a hard time with the top. Looking in through a small crevice above the alt. I could see misalignment of the holes from the top being rotated. I could grab the hose and line it up but not get it to stay. My solution was to put a wrench on the bottom bolt, station dad down there to tighten it down on my signal. I lined it up, he tightened the bottom bolt (wanted him to align it, and me to tighten but he could not see what I was looking at) and it stayed in place. That may be the only car repair dad does all year. Persuaded the top bolt in, hooked back up the bottom hose of the radiator, filled and it warmed up to operating temp quickly at idle then stabilized there. Got the wheel back on and it was still doing fine on the test drive....Only thing that bugs me is that the check engine light came back on....If it don't go out I may try having it reset.

[Username1]

Ah.... Squeezing in a few repairs while the temperature permits.....
That is a pretty interesting thermostat you got growing there....

Me and the wife inherited a 1997 Chevy Express B I G Van 5.0L
actually a Conversion van, Living room on wheels ! Complete with
CRT TV and VCR ! - Well anyway, we have been seeing antifreeze
on the ground every now and then, turns out it's the Intake Manifold
gasket slowly dissolving. In addition to that a few weeks ago on a trip
the engine 127K Miles developed a bad miss...... That turns out to be
some little creature living under the upper intake manifold....
"The Creature of Darkness" as referred to in one YouTube video....
The Original Poppet valve "Spider" Fuel injection system beginning to
take a dump..... So In this "Warm Spell" here in Freeze-Land I am
doing the intake manifold - Spider - Serpentine belt - and Belt Tensioner.

A few other little doo-daads near by are also on the list..... Guess What !?

Your little Envoy may have the same little creature living under your hood as well....
If you're lucky the previous owner has already replaced all that stuff with
the upgraded parts ! Spider and Intake Manifold Gaskets.
Anyway good luck to ya !

PS take a look at your Belt Tensioner ours was wobbly and almost ready to fall
off with no warning noise at all..... Good Luck !

PS2 - YouTube is great to preview all these repairs !


.

[MadMan]

Oh god I hate those spider injection vortec engines. Absolute garbage. The v8s aren't that bad, but the v6s are not even worth the time or money, imo. If anyone here has one of those, just... do yourself a favor and get rid of it.

If you're doing a lower intake gasket (very common to leak coolant, btw), while you're at it, replace that spider crap with the retrofit kits you can buy. They're literally the same price as the oem type spider, it's direct fit, looks similar, but instead of the stupid poppet valves that require surgical cleanliness and precise amounts of vacuum to operate (which you're not going to get from an engine designed in the 1960s) it uses mini regular injectors.

->HERE<-

Also, when you're reinstalling the upper intake, be extremely careful with the giant oval-shaped o-ring around the big ol' injector plug - it's VERY easy to pinch. Rub it with grease - a little, not a lot - and ease the intake down onto it, focusing on that seal, and take your time.

Also, also, the distributors on these always have problems. They get loosey-goosey sometimes and the shaft wobbles inside. And despite being non-adjustable, they actually have some wiggle room, and need to be adjusted to 0 degrees +/- 1 degree. Kind of need a scanner for that, unfortunately. You also have to do it pretty much while the engine is hot and running, it's very unpleasant, but should be much easier on a van than on a pickup. After you finish the intake, you'll probably get a check engine light for crankshaft/camshaft correlation, because of the distributor adjustment.

[Electronic M]

Mine is an inline 6 so hopefully is is not as bad as the V engines.

[Username1]

Yes I have read all the poop about the Vortec and the Spiders. I am upgrading to
the new Multi point spider. Seen all the videos about setup and distributor.
Taking my time and hoping it will all go well......

Inline 6 ~ You may have escaped the spider deal....... But I bet they have some
other little doo-hickey waiting in the wings for you.... I thought Envoys used
V6 engines......

Thanks .

.

[Electronic M]

Originally Posted by Username1

I thought Envoys used
V6 engines......
.

The first gen (mine is a second gen thus I6) Envoys that were based on the S10 chassis did use a V6...A friend has had ~6 SUVs on that platform (Chevy, olds, and GMC all put their name on one) and swears by them, and a mutual friend can't see what he sees in those.