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English NTSC TV's.
When Sony imported colour TV's into England in the early 70's they didn't have a PAL licence, to get round this they converted the PAL signal to NTSC. They did this by dropping the alternate phase line of PAL, stored the previous line with a delay line, repeated it & used an NTSC decoder, & it worked. My Mother had an 18 inches version of this set & it had an outstanding picture. The only difference between it & a standard PAL set was it had a hue control on the front, a standard PAL set didn't need a hue control as the hue never changed as the PAL system canceled out any hue errors. It was still working perfect when my Mother passed away in 1994, my sister had it after & I don't know what happened to it..
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I've seen this on a CVM-1310E set here in Australia. I'm not sure where it was originally imported from. I don't think Sony were the only ones to use this approach - though I don't remember who else did it. I don't consider these sets to be NTSC, they're still PAL - just using a different (simpler/cheaper?) approach.
The "real" UK NTSC TVs would be the experimental 405 line NTSC sets that were tested before they decided to go with a 625 line PAL system. The KV-1800AS was the first Sony to be officially sold here and has a proper PAL decoder. When we got a eventually got an official KV-13??AS model it also had a proper PAL decoder. |
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They seem to have been out for several years now. I have a few that can operate on NTSC-M&C, Secam and PAL. I refer to my Samsung 15", as my Osama Ben-Laden set, as it looks just like his. I bought on E-BAY and it was originally sold in Saudi-Arabia. |
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It took a group of highly-gifted engineers to come up with that scheme. |
Audiokarma |
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Done in Silicon Valley? Even with workstation circuit development > simulation > photo layout systems, what if fabricated batch had bugs!? After all that development, many chips soon obsolete, before R&D costs can be recovered? |
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I think Sony were among the first with multi-standard with their KX-20PS1, KX-27PS1 and their various cube monitors. They all (at least in the versions sold/found here in Australia) supports PAL, NTSC and even SECAM. Of course these were high end models - multistandard didn't become a standard feature in lower end sets until much later. Even then Sony lead the way. I've got a basic low end Sony 14" set from around 1990 that does PAL/NTSC (probably not SECAM) when most similar sets from other manufacturers were still PAL only.
When PlayStation and DVD became a thing everyone here needed a multistandard TV. They may not know or care what PAL/NTSC are, but they noticed when their imported games/DVD movies didn't play in color. Official local releases are all PAL, but US imports are obviously NTSC as are almost all bootlegs and pirate copies (despite usually coming from parts of Asia that use PAL). |
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Hehehehe.. I remember reading about how PAL & SECAM were developed-Ostensibly, to be "Superior" to the crude & "Inferior" NTSC, but REALLY were developed as a "Thumb in the Nose" of the Americans, & ultimately RCA, whose heavy-handed sales tactics infuriated the Europeans.... But the Japanese were able to negate PAL & SECAM by "Back Engineering" them w/decoders. And, as we all know, even the mighty American home electronics industry couldn't stand up to the onslaught of Japan, Inc. Mene mene Tekel...
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Benevolent Despot |
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Well I learned something new about foreign TVs today...
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Tom C. Zenith: The quality stays in EVEN after the name falls off! What I want. --> http://www.videokarma.org/showpost.p...62&postcount=4 |
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I've heard SECAM described as System Essentially Contrary to American Method and NTSC described as Never Twice the Same Color. I assume there is one for PAL as well.
I'd also heard that many countries that chose SECAM over PAL did so in an effort to prevent their citizens viewing broadcasts from neighboring PAL countries. |
Audiokarma |
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PAL was sometimes called "Peace At Last" in the UK.
NTSC is good system but with 1960s technology, let alone 1950s, it was very hard to maintain good colour accuracy through the broadcast chain. Ideas of using phase alternation were first tried at Hazeltine Labs in the late 1940s (I think I've got that right). Henri de France's SECAM and Bruch's PAL were both solutions to the colour accuracy problem. SECAM is utterly different to NTSC except for the use of colour difference signals. It's also a horror story for anything byond simple cuts in the studio. Even a fade requires horrible processes that degrade the picture. PAL used the idea of phase alternation to stop phase errors giving wrong colours. Line by line alternation depended on having a low cost 1 line delay line in the receiver. PAL receivers without one "Simple PAL" didn't give very good results and were never marketed. AFAIK. There was no need for Sony to reverse engineer PAL. The PAL system was described in the Bruch/Telefunken patents. What Sony did was treat PAL as a sort of NTSC to navigate round the patents. Hence these Sony sets needed a hue control which true PAL sets did not. Commercially these sets were a great success and paved the way for Japanes dominance of the UK TV market. The likes of Sony and Toshiba made good reliable sets which the UK industry couldn't match until a few years later. Last edited by ppppenguin; 07-23-2014 at 03:05 AM. |
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Various notes
Just had the leisure to check out this thread, and perhaps some collected notes could be of interest also months later:
Another one, I don't know where it originated: "Pay for Additional Luxury". Quote:
But in practice more and more PAL gear came into use also at SECAM stations. Inavoidable result was at least a final PAL-SECAM conversion, and also cascades of SECAM-PAL-SECAM or even more steps were not uncommon. It is my impression that this did much more harm to the picture quality than the specific weaknesses of the SECAM system (which appear to be overemphasized thanks to clever PAL marketing, just as it is the case with NTSC). Quote:
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"SECAM-capable" TV sets were common in West Germany, but I understand that this was just good for East German TV (and French forces TV in Berlin) while only real, expensive multinorm sets (usually also being capable of NTSC-M, put on air in Germany by AFN) could receive the crazy French "L" system. This led to a rather widespread misbelief that "French SECAM" is different from "East Bloc SECAM". Of course it was the same SECAM III B, and I know a TV engineer who liked to provide evidence of this to surprised layman by tuning into an analogue satellite signal from France and hooking an old Staßfurt set to the modulator output of the receiver. Quote:
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I.e. what is being transmit in Brazil. That's something I'm wondering about for a long time. And the same goes for the approach of Paraguay and Uruguay to modulate 625/50 video as if it were 525/60, i.e. with 4.2 MHz bandwith. |
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When I visited the UK and Ireland in 2000, that was what I noticed right away-the flicker on 50 Hz CRT sets. It was very strong to me, as I was only used to 60 Hz CRT displays here in the USA.
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Chris Quote from another forum: "(Antique TV collecting) always seemed to me to be a fringe hobby that only weirdos did." |
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I started a thread on 'UK Vintage Radio Repair & Restoration' site last year about this subject, it's called 'Sony PAL to NTSC converter'. It explains how Sony did it. It's burst back into life in the last couple of days..
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Audiokarma |
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