strange console phonograph- pictures

[rob Cashin]

Ok, so here it is. Nobody has put in any input yet, so hopefully these pictures will help. Has anybody seen anything like this one before?

[init4fun]

The Amplifier and speaker look to be late 30s to early 40s vintage , wheras the cabinet looks to be 1920s vintage . I believe you've got a "Frankenphono" , something a handy hobbyist cobbled together as a fun project for himself . The cabinet looks like it was the kind of phono that had a manually wound spring for turning the platter and had non electric sound reproduction (a horn , maybe even formally mounted within the cabinet ) . The amp and speaker were likely seen as a vast improvement over the sound of the original system , and it was likely done long before it would have had any collector value . Speaking of which , since that's where a lot of these discussions go , it's only worth what someone would pay for it , and in the depressed market of today it's not really worth anything considering the updated internals .

[rob Cashin]

hey thank you much! i paid 10 bucks for it anyway. i had a suspicion because it was spliced together inside (electrical tape) and the turn table is free inside- you can pull it right out, it isnt bolted down. it is pretty neat, i was thinking about updating it inside. i do believe the cabinet is mahogany which is great. ill keep everyone posted on what i do with it. thanks again!

[init4fun]

Your welcome , and yes , it IS a nice lookin cabinet and I'll bet if you do a bit of restoration on it you'll get some decent sound out of it . First things , after a good cleanup and repair of any questionable wiring , will be to replace the capacitors in the amp . At this point in time they have "aged out" of their predicted safe operating lifespan and could short and ruin the transformer in the amp . After the amp has been "recapped" the turntable itself will need a proper cleaning and lube , best done by someone with a bit of experience . The pick up in the tone arm is highly likely to need rebuilding or replacing , since these don't age well either . When your all done with all that you may consider installing a newer , larger , more modern speaker since the one installed in there now looks kinda small to be expecting any big "room filling sound" out of . The great thing here is that since you want it just for a cool old piece , and not some mint condition original valuable antique , ya can have some fun with it and set it up the way that best suits your intended use of it .

PS , with very little electronic alteration , a jack could also be added to play your Ipod or similar through it , giving you yet another option for pushing sound through it

[Reece]

Let's not ignore the fact that the MP company card is on the back of it as is their logo elsewhere. Reading the obit of the founder on the previous post, it would appear that the company made few but well-made products. The look of this unit is consistent with such manufacture in the 1950's. The fact that the changer is loose and there's electrical tape here and there just means that someone has been at it in the past. I don't believe it's a frankenphono at all but entirely as represented by the card on the back. This could have been for special markets such as schools, churches, etc.

[rob Cashin]

it has a card inside as well that has a model number and the MP name. you can see it in the picture of the turn table. i was thinking though, that it is older than the 1950's. the platter of the record player is felt, like on an old gramophone and the inside where the player is, is stained that old 1920's green. im not too sure what to make of it yet. im still deciding as to what im going to do with it. its definitely something ive never seen before, as far as the style and brand.

[init4fun]

I see you have the amp advertised in the Sturbridge craigslist . Are you planning to put a bigger/newer/different amp into the record player or are you just scrapping it ?

[rob Cashin]

im going to put something more modern in the cabinet. i have no use for the amp. i know it turns on but i cant get any sound out of it, and it only turns on when its set on 78's on the turn table. so im sure it would be more work and money than its worth to get it going with the old equipment. id like someone to use it for something, but i dont have really any use for it

[init4fun]

When you say , "something more modern" are you talkin transistor electronics to replace the tube amp ? Are you planning on using the record player at all ? Cause if you are , the mechanical portion (the turntable) is gonna need a lot more work (read $$) than the amp will . The amp only should need it's capacitors replaced , but the turntable will need clean/lube/adjust , new pick up arm cartridge (which is just about assured to be dead , these die just like capacitors do , from age and sitting) , and it's rubber drive wheel (or belt) replaced . Also , if the amp's tubes only light on 78 RPM and not on 45 , that's a fault of the turntable itself and not the amp !

Clearly stating your final objective for this piece will greatly aid in giving appropriate answers

[rob Cashin]

i dont know how to recap. not the first thing about it. the turn table spins but barely. it has like 3 idler wheels that drive the platter and make the speeds. i was thinking of putting something with transistors in it. i have a bunch of stereo equipment. im just going to keep my eyes peeled for something i feel would be a good fit for inside. i love my vinyl but i was thinking about maybe putting just an am/fm tuner in there. i dont know yet. its a small cabinet. id love to learn how to recap stuff, i have a few things that need it but it seems so overwhelming. plus, im not a fan of electrical shock or the smell of something electrical burning up. any ideas?

[init4fun]

Sure , as far as ideas go , here's some ;

If you do a search for the term "recap" you will find several different easy tutorials on how to do it without trauma to yourself or the equipment . You will find that it's a pretty darned easy thing to do once ya get the basic skills required . Can you solder ? cause even to put transistor guts in there you are going to need to join wires of some kind and when working on sound equipment (even old not terribly high powered sound equipment) things like wirenuts or crimp connectors ain't gonna do it . If you can't solder , make that your first mission , to learn how . again , there are plenty of tutorials out there in internet land for this . Since this is a simple 3 tube amp it will be the perfect learning tool and is of low enough value so as to be no big deal if it doesn't turn out perfectly . Can you read schematic diagrams ? Do you have a basic idea of the functions of the major components , like resistors , capacitors , transformers , and in this case , tubes ? There are you tube videos that describe all these things and more , if your lookin to learn them . With a few days spent looking at these searches , a lot of the mystery of this will be gone and you'll do just fine working on it if that's what your looking to do .

PS , to most "Purist's" ears , transistor guts will never sound as good in there as good ol tubes , and the very idea of such conversions are regarded as something akin to blasphemy . I'm a lot more easy going than that , and would like to see you enjoy it however you decide to equip it . When it comes right down to it , you'll end up doing more work to install the transistor guts than to recap the tube amp , for instance how will the transistor's volume control circuitry work ? will you try to use the tube amp"s controls ? I'm pretty sure they will be different . Also , that tube amp was built to have a phonograph pickup played through it . Most "modern" transistor's inputs are designed around a "line level" input signal (think the output of an Ipod , for ex) and may not do well trying to amplify the somewhat smaller sound of the tone arm cartridge . You will spend less than $20 to recap the amp yourself , and the turntable is gonna need quite a bit more than that to operate correctly . Lastly , getting it running with the tube amp will give you an idea as to it's general performance , which will be a help in future decisions of possible modification ....

[rob Cashin]

i know how to solder but i have no idea what any of the internals do. its sad that i can fix my car but not my radio. anyways, i think im just going to send the amp to my cousin who builds guitar amps for a living. as for the turn table, im going to hunt around for one that might fit. i was looking at one of my GE consoles, and it looks like it would just drop right in, of course with some modification and maybe a new piece of wood inside. i am a fan of the warm sound of tubes, so i have decided to keep it that way. maybe ill watch him do it and ask 1000 questions. im better hands on, the reading of how-to's just doesnt work for me. the turn table is going to be a parts candidate. the wiring is so poor and frayed inside it just isnt worth the headache of trying to fix. much appreciated for the information. ill keep you posted. as of right now, im going to sand down and refinish the cabinet... and find a nice paisley pattern for the speaker cover

[Electronic M]

Here is a good article on recapping. http://www.antiqueradio.org/recap.htm

I've been doing recap work for 10 years now at least, and if you placed that chassis, a hot soldering iron, solder, and new caps suitable to replace the originals infront of me I could probably have that thing recapped inside of 5 minutes. Three tube audio chassis are nothing to recap. There are probably only 2-3 filter caps (which you have to mind the polarity on), and 2-7 paper caps. I could probably teach a monkey to do a chassis like that.

[Reece]

And remember as we stated before, the 45 RPM record was introduced in 1949, which means the changer has to be after that.

[rob Cashin]

would anyone know where i would be able to find a schematic for the amp? i looked for quite a few hours last night and couldnt find a thing. the tube numbers are 6sj7gt, 322nf3 and a 3225647-3. all of your motivational speaking is making me want to fix this myself LOL. remember, i have not done this before but im sure i can handle it. any help would be appreciated. i havent been able to find anything about the MP brand anywhere.