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In the context of this discussion it's probably worth putting a link here to the PBS Frontline documentary Coming from Japan.
This film is 30 years old now, and chronicles the decline and fall of the American TV industry (and consumer electronics as a whole). Spoiler: it was a long con by a group of Japanese companies, led by Matsushita, planned and executed for years: high prices in their protected market to offset losses from dumping products in the US, buy up the American companies as they began to fail, and shut them down. It was a brilliant plan that worked perfectly. The final nail in the coffin was when the Nixon administration traded the TV industry (via not enforcing tariffs) to Japan in exchange for permission to put a military base there. This is, to me, a heartbreaking film. It's full of candid interviews with executives and employees of Zenith and Motorola/Quasar who are first sounding worried, and then alarmed, and finally defeated as their entire industry is dismantled around them. So many great brands, that were part of communities, and stood for something, gone. Zenith, Motorola, Packard Bell, Admiral, Sylvania, RCA, Magnavox, GE...each of these were factories where American people worked, who bought parts from American companies, and employed American ad agencies, and transport companies, and on and on. |
#34
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I saw that documentary when it originally aired, and it severely affected my view on Japanese consumer electronics. It doesn't account for the success of Sony, which had a technical advantage (the trinitron). It is hard to feel much sympathy for the Japanese companies now as they fail in the face of Korean and Chinese competition.
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#35
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These are my 50 Cent for that case:
If you take a look on the japanese electronics industry you have to take a look on the history of Japan, too. Japan was a closen country for hundreds of years, no one in, no one out, like North Korea today. Japan began to open step by step after an american agression with a battle ship entering the harbour of Tokyo saying if you don`t deal with us we will shoot down the whole city made of paper. That was around 1880 or so. That leaded to a 100 – 110 Volts power system, followed by the american TV standard. In the thirties the german radio service magazine called „Funkschau“ warned Germany and the rest of the world, that japanese technic students spreading signs that they want to rule the world!!!! Yes, that was in 1935 or close by! During that time american electronics companies were giving the japs the shoes to learn to run. One of the examples for these kind of „joint ventures“ was Nippon Columbia, started with TV- production in 1953 at Kawasaki. Btw. Japan is still a closen society by the culture and the market. This is visable for tourists and collectors of vintage radios and TVs. I own a fine collection of vintage 30s-50s original jap radios incl. hornspeakers and 50s TV sets incl. some roundies. Tubes and chassis constructions are typical american based. Even the cabinet style is about 90% american based. Only a few sets have a european style or something japanese (like a temple). About 97% of all japanese pre-war radios were one circle radios. Unusual is the american writing on sets, ON/OFF, VOLUME; SOUND, BRIGHTNESS etc. is standard. I asked a jap friend about it and he told that english was "hip". They never produced sets with scales and japanese letters for the stations! Most radios have only the frequencies on the dial, only very few giving names of stations. It is uncommon that consumer products were in that time offered with user informations in another language. O.K., today everything is in english here in europe. Japanese electronics stuff was always back in time, with the victory of the transistor in small radios at the end of the 50s and in small TVs in the beginning of the 50s, they started the fight. Japanese radios used up to the mid 50s old american tubes, the ones with the 2 thick pins. Up to the late 50s Octal tubes were common. The main used CRT diameter was up to the beginning 60s 14“, in western Europe 21“-24“! It is hard to understand that this industry was strong enough to knock down the whole world! Something about japanese pricing: It is for sure, that selling electrical sets cheap, but selling spare parts expensive when no alternative is given, is a way to take the customers cash! Example jap trap 1: My father brought me a big Sony Stereo amp from curbside. It was only 5 years old in 1982. The amp was kicked out in the street because of the expensive service costs! I by myself paid for 2 original Sony output transistors close to 80,- Deutsch Marks! For one of these transistors was a similiar american/european transistor available, price: 5,50 DM! Example jap trap 2: One of my father`s employees bought himself a Datsun Sunny station wagon in the mid 70s. This car was not a luxury car! A short time after the end of the warranty the tail gate wiper motor went south! The price of the replacement (made of gold) in 1978: (800,- Deutsch Marks – in words eigth hundred!) What do you think you could have bought for 800,- DM in 1978? For just 798,- DM you could have bought a luxury DUAL record player CS 721 incl. Shure V 15 III What did you pay in ´78 for a tail gate wiper motor from a mid 70s Chevy or Ford wagon? Now its your turn! Talking about rat nests, who ever opened a luxury Marantz (ex US company!) Esotheric amp? My brother picked up one once curbside! Two well educated professional TV repair technicians lost their interest to repair it. Both burned down 2-3 sets of output transistors on their own costs. Couldn`t believe that someone will place so many caps, resistors, transistors on that small solid state board! CRAP! Regards, TV-collector
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Scotty, beam me up, there is no more 4/3 Television and AM radio in Germany! Last edited by TV-collector; 08-26-2019 at 06:19 AM. Reason: writing error |
Audiokarma |
#36
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Recall working on Zenith System III and that it was well designed and advanced. Some repair shops made a lot of money by repairing the modules, rather than just replacing them. Also recall RCA at the time of transition from GE ownership to Thomson. Huge change in design.
CRTs for the last of the large RCA TV sets were made by Hitachi in those days, IIRC around the early to mid 1980s. There was an issue with how the new CRTs where run in the sets in the quest for more brightness - the high brightness areas would bloom and look 'ugly' for lack of better explanation. I worked for an RCA distributor at the time and was asked to look into it because sets were coming back. I found that the problem happened during high peak beam currents. The factory enginers said that the high currents were heating the shadow mask causing deformation. It was hushed up for the most part and some changes made. The CRTs were recalled and internal changes made for the new replacements by Hitachi, and none should be out there but If one happens to have one of the sets with the troublesome CRT just lower the peak beam current. I'd rather have the last of the US-made RCA sets than any other. They were assembled in the states with the Hitachi CRTs and other parts manufactured in Mexico, USA, and Canada.
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Timeless Information for Retro-Tech Hobbyists and Hardware Hackers No Kowtow
Last edited by Opcom; 08-28-2019 at 07:28 AM. |
#37
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made a profit selling sets. others didnt. They did it through image. Prices were high to. A base 19" Sony listed for near $600 & sold in the low fives. A base RCA or Zenith could be had for under $400, a GE under $300 73 Zeno LFOD ! |
#38
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I STILL say WE did it to ourselves in killing off our consumer electronics industry.. I remember going w/my parents in say late 1969, early '70 to a furniture store that sold Home Entertainment centers, "Occaisional" furniture, stuff like that. It was NOT an "El Cheapo" kind of place. They had a pretty good line of RCA, Zenith, Sylvania, Motorola "Consoles"... The QUALITY on them was ABYSSIMAL, even to a kid of 12, 13 like me. Wood was all either plastiwood, or fiberboard, hardly any of it on any of these high-zoot-$1K-"Home entertainment Centers" was even approaching REAL. The plastic knobs, buttons, all that was cheap, nasty feeling "Carnival grade" plastic, that I managed to barely touch, & SEVERAL of 'em came off in my hand. The RCA IIRC was sposedly their TOTLfanciest color set, the others were, too, but their pic quality left a LOT to be desired. The "Stirreos" sounded cheap, tinny, boomy-ass bass terrible separation, and the RCA, even on the local FM station was deaf as a stone. Like I said, these were all TOTL "Consuls", I wouldn't have given you a plugged nickel for the lot of 'em. The finish/varnish, IIRC on one of 'em was oily, greasy feeling & STUNK-Kinda smelt like they'd mixed Bat Guano in w/the varnish... If THAT was the best the mighty Amurrican Consumer electronics industry was capable of making, well, Methinks we are better off w/o them. Oh, & yeah, I think none of the TVs were "Soiled State", they were all, mebbe not the Sylvania-STILL largely Tooobs.
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Benevolent Despot |
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If only Philco had persevered just a little longer...
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Here in Britain we had almost all our TV market to ourselves as no other countries set makers could be bothered to make 405 lines sets, the only one AFAIK was Sony. This changed in the early 70's when we went over to 625 lines when everyone & their dog started exporting TV's to us. Some were tweaked to work in the UK by having the sound carrier frequency increased to 6 Mhz & the VHF tuner removed, on my parents Sony KV1800 there was a blanking plate where the VHF tuner should have been. Don't know what the last British made TV set was...
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Audiokarma |
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Last edited by KentTeffeteller; 09-25-2019 at 07:39 AM. |
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