Phil Collins - Seriously Live

[Dude111]

I was listening to my Phil Collins Concert I have on VHS again earlier

Oh my its goregous!! -- The original analogue concert audio is on the linear track and it sounds incredibly beautiful!!!

I cant believe they left the analogue soundtrack there... Probably figured no one would hear it anyway (Most VCRs are HIFI -- Im glad Mine isnt)

The HIFI track is digital trash of the concert which I dont wanna hear.....

Phil Collins has an excellent concert and all his 80s music is in glorious analogue!! (I havent ever heard most of those songs so nice)

For 1990 its amazing they left it there!! (The video is composite analogue so the analogue audio is there already but they could have taken it off and put the digi crap there (They probably figured no one listens to the linear track)

IT SOUNDS SO MUCH BETTER THAN DIGITAL TRASH!!!!!!

[Electronic M]

VHS Hi-Fi IS ANALOG! VHS Hi-Fi is analog audio FM modulated then recorded and played back off the video head drum (which has better bandwidth, dynamic range and noise floor than the linear audio tracks).
Hell, VHS Hi-Fi is supposedly the BEST ANALOG recording format ever offered, with better linearity, frequency response, and noise floor than Reel Tape or CD.

VHS, and S-VHS tape are both 100% analog formats in the US...They don't have any digital audio or video tracks.
There's only 2 ways you can even convey digital audio over VHS in the US:
1.) PCM which is an audio only format... Basically PCM takes the digital audio signal and converts it to a "video" signal that looks like a black screen with white dashes that flicker on and off in turn with the digital data....PCM tapes in the NTSC region can't hold any video to accompany the PCM audio so there are no movies or concerts with video that have digital audio.
2.) If you convert a digital recording in the mastering/duplication studio to analog and record the analog audio to VHS...But its no longer digital at that point. Also unless a tape is dual language duplication facilities that made VHS tapes would dub the same tracks of the master onto BOTH the Hi-Fi AND THE LINEAR tracks!...So if the Hi-Fi analog tracks are a dub of some digital master tape then the linear tracks are too....So either way you're listening to an analog dub of a digital master tape... You're just choosing the lowest quality pair (the linear tracks) of the 4 channels of analog audio VHS carries.

You probably didn't understand half of what I said and won't learn anything from it given your track record.

But you come across as stupid as a some one who bought a 4 cylinder Ford Mustang instead of the V8 claiming their 4 cylinder Mustang is faster than a Tesla. Not only are you wrong but you're bragging about the worst version of what you like being better without knowing you have the worst version. You're as laughable as the emperor bragging about his new clothing that only idiots can't see.

[ARC Tech-109]

My Impala SS is faster than the Tesla but it doesn't sound as good as Beta HiFi

[Dude111]

Originally Posted by Electronic M

VHS Hi-Fi IS ANALOG! VHS Hi-Fi is analog audio FM modulated then recorded and played back off the video head drum (which has better bandwidth, dynamic range and noise floor than the linear audio tracks).

But the HIFI track on the Phil Collins tape IS A DIGITALLY SOURCED recording.. (Like listening to a CD)


The linear track is the original composite analogue sourced recording and to me is beautiful..

[old_tv_nut]

The phrase "Composite analog sourced" is non-sensical. Composite is a term applicable to composite video, which carries no audio whatsoever.

Is this the tape you have?
https://www.discogs.com/release/9335...Live-In-Berlin

I can find no indication that the linear tracks and the Hi-Fi came from different sources.

[Electronic M]

Originally Posted by Dude111

But the HIFI track on the Phil Collins tape IS A DIGITALLY SOURCED recording.. (Like listening to a CD)


The linear track is the original composite analogue sourced recording and to me is beautiful..

Unless they specifically say something to the effect of 'digital audio on Hi-Fi track, analog audio on linear track' on the tape and or jacket, there's a 99.9% chance the same digital master recording was fed to both the linear audio track input and the Hi-Fi input of the industrial machine that made your tape...Some of those industrial machines that made mass-produced tape releases didn't even have provisions for recording different audio onto the linear tracks.

If the tape doesn't specifically say there's a difference between the sources for the linear and Hi-Fi tracks, then there almost certainly isn't.

[old_tv_nut]

@Dude111 --

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serious_Hits..._Live!

The LP, cassette, and CD album was a composite of different venues in the tour; while the VHS, Beta, and DVD were the Berlin venue only. There is no reason to assume that the master sources for the linear tracks and Hi-Fi tracks were any different.

Do you have documentation to the contrary?

[Ed in Tx]

Originally Posted by Dude111

The linear track is the original composite analogue sourced recording and to me is beautiful..

Yep nothing like some wow & flutter, harmonic distortion, and a few occasional dropouts to enhance the sound!

[DVtyro]

Originally Posted by Ed in Tx

Yep nothing like some wow & flutter, harmonic distortion, and a few occasional dropouts to enhance the sound!

Seriously cannot figure out where all the people who love ANY analog stuff including horrible low-speed high-noise high-W&F garbage come from. Digital has been a revelation, a great improvement across the board and an equalizer in that both rich and poor can now get the same great quality for peanuts. Before the digital age, good analog quality did cost a pretty penny, and good analog video quality was not accessible even to wealthy people unless they owned a personal TV studio.

In terms of audio, the best consumer analog media was sourced from digital sources, like DDD/Digalog audio cassettes, they were the best.

[old_tv_nut]

@Dude111 --

I repeat:

Do you have documentation to the contrary?

I am happy to be corrected if there is real evidence.

[ChrisW6ATV]

Originally Posted by Electronic M

If the tape doesn't specifically say there's a difference between the sources for the linear and Hi-Fi tracks, then there almost certainly isn't.

Of course, there is no different source for the two tracks. The linear track sounds mediocre, therefore it is "better" to the OP.

Originally Posted by Ed in Tx

Yep nothing like some wow & flutter, harmonic distortion, and a few occasional dropouts to enhance the sound!

Yes! If it is lousy enough, it can even go from "analog" all the way to the nausea-inducing "analogooey" as the OP likes to use.

What if it ever is revealed that Phil Collins and his band and technicians used digital mixers in their shows for that tour? Will the OP then decide it is all garbage, and throw away the tape?

This "I love analog" (or worse, "analogooey") stuff gets really annoying after enough endless repeats.

[dishdude]

I can see the appreciation for vinyl, but magnetic tape really was a lousy medium for video and audio.

[Electronic M]

Originally Posted by dishdude

I can see the appreciation for vinyl, but magnetic tape really was a lousy medium for video and audio.

Reel to reel could be excellent (so could cassette but you had to have a high quality player and a well mastered tape that wasn't abused), better than vinyl if regular playback was desired as it wouldn't wear nearly as much. For the analog era tape was about the best you could get for video... Especially if you wanted to record.

[ChrisW6ATV]

For an entirely analog, moderately-priced consumer format, Super VHS Hi-Fi can be pretty impressive relative to the limits of NTSC itself.

[John Adams]

Originally Posted by ChrisW6ATV

For an entirely analog, moderately-priced consumer format, Super VHS Hi-Fi can be pretty impressive relative to the limits of NTSC itself.

Back in the 80’s, JVC made a prosumer Svhs with TBC. (Time base correction generator). Supposed to be able to edit a tape from one deck to a second with virtually no loss. I remember reading somewhere that a few very low budget UHF stations were using them, versus the much more expensive Sony studio equipment. Seems like it started at $599. I still the one model under it that I paid $499 for.