70's Zenith
 

Starsky and Hutch ride again! Just found this set locally and for the right price (gratis). Will be picking it up soon. Is not working right now, but am suspecting that relay on the power supply as that seems to be a fairly common problem with these sets.

Back in the mid 70's I'd walk past a Zenith dealer to and from school and always saw sets like this. Not sure, but this may be an "Avanti" which I always found humorous as that's also the name of a Studebaker.

Remember thier Space Phone speaker phone deal? How about the Zoom feature? Man, they were so ahead of their time, makes what's happened to them so much more of a shame.

Anthony

I got the Big Daddy to that one
 

Yeee Ha,
I got that things grandpaw, mine looks kinda like it except mine has:
A flip up top
8 Track
AM/FM stereo
QUADPHONIC
(2) Big ole funky speakers to set on each side
I'm going to post a picture tomorrow just to show it off!

Re: I got the Big Daddy to that one
 

Ahhhh, the Quadraphonic wars of the 70's! :uzi: :lazer: Hehe. These era sets would look best showing an episode of the Sonny & Cher show, or Police Story etc. :thmbsp:

I for one am looking forward to seeing your set!

Anthony

Re: 70s Zenith
 

Yes, the Spacephone and Zoom features of high-end Zenith console TVs of the '70s were ahead of their time, all right. However, they weren't around for long. I think Zenith dropped the Spacephone from its sets by the late '70s-early '80s; the Zoom feature was discontinued shortly thereafter.

I once saw an advertisement for Zenith's Spacephone which showed three men sitting on a couch in front of a Spacephone equipped TV. Right in the middle of a program, the sound of a ringing telephone comes over the speakers, at which point one of the men picks up the remote, hands it to the guy in the middle, and says, "Hubie, answer the television."

I laughed out loud when I saw that ad in a magazine. The copy writers for Zenith's ads really had a sense of humor.

Re: Re: I got the Big Daddy to that one
 

So am I. I didn't know Zenith had quad sound in any of its large three-way consoles of the '70s; however, if the feature was in any of their sets, it likely only lasted one or two model years. The reason is that quadraphonic stereo never really caught on with audiophiles; in fact, the system was an utter failure (too many standards for and too much bickering over Dolby, quad FM broadcasting and so on) and quietly disappeared by the end of the decade. (I have seen only one quad system in my life; that was 31 years ago.) I remember reading an article on quad sound in an old issue of an electronics magazine in the early 70s which began: "Four channel sound. It's FANTASTIC! It's STUPENDOUS! It's COLOSSAL! And it is also A BOMB!"

The author of that article had the last part absolutely correct. I don't think quad FM broadcasting, for example, ever caught on in many if not most major cities except New York, Chicago and Los Angeles. (The networks may have tried quadraphonic-stereo broadcast experiments on their owned stations in those cities.) When I was a kid growing up in suburban Cleveland in the '70s, I don't remember hearing any four-channel records or tapes, much less reading about or hearing any of the city's FM stations broadcasting in four-channel, although the classical-music station might have tried its hand at quad for a few months.

Am not aware of any TVs that had a Quad system, but am assuming that the previous poster meant that the 8 track in that set was a Quad.

There were two radio stations in Manhattan that had competing Quad systems. A buddy of mine had a high zoot Panasonic (or was it a Technics?) Quad receiver with a small scope that displayed the 4 channels in graphic form.

He also had a direct drive turntable with a Quad pickup....we'd play the few Quad records then available, but spent more time listening to his "test" record to really appreciate the effect.

I think that today's surround sound systems are effectively better and with fewer speakers to deal with. My modern Sony has a spatial expander dealio that is "interesting"

Question, how interchangable (if at all) are RCA and Zenith color tubes? I realize that they're different animals, but could they be interchanged with effort? Also, what's your opinions regarding picture quality and longevity? Thanks

Anthony

Re: 70s Zenith
 

If the two tubes were of the same type, e. g. 23EGP22, I don't see why one could not interchange RCA and Zenith CRTs, although personally I'd replace a Zenith tube with an RCA for reasons outlined below.

I have both a Zenith and an RCA color TV. I have to say my 1999 RCA XL-100, with a dark-tint CRT, has a much better picture than my Zenith Sentry 2, which was new some eight years ago. The dark-tint CRTs in today's tube TVs, in my opinion, have much better pictures, especially in bright lighting conditions. The dark-tint CRTs (including Panasonic's PanaBlack series, Sony's famous Trinitron tubes, Zenith Chromacolor, et al.) produce much richer colors and blacker blacks (not to mention whiter whites) than the earlier tubes with dark gray faceplates. Also, today's color sets have many more and better designed color signal processing circuits than did sets of as recently as 15 years ago; they are completely automatic (as opposed to sets with so-called "auto-color" buttons on their front panels; these ordinarily only switched in preset color controls and were not true automatic color systems).

It's difficult to say, however, which tube lasts longest. The longevity of a CRT depends mainly upon how much the set is used. TVs which are used many hours a day or kept on from early morning to late night are more likely to require CRT replacement (not to mention repair service in general) in a relatively short period of time than sets which are generally only used during prime time.

Given the problems now being reported with Zenith sets (which are now manufactured by Gold Star), however, especially in the area of the CRT, I would have to say, if pressed for a quick answer, the RCA tubes are probably better in the longevity department. In this forum alone I have read of more problems with recent-vintage Zenith sets and their CRTs than I have read of the same problems with RCA sets. (It has been reported in this forum that the CRTs in Zenith sets of 1992 vintage to the present have the worst reliability record.)

The CRT in my RCA, however, after almost four years, still works as well as it did the day I bought the set. (I recently heard of one situation in which the CRT in an RCA TV of late-90s vintage failed after only two years, but this problem may have been due to a design flaw in the tube.)

RCA's ColorTrak system was, if memory serves, one of the first (if not in fact the first) completely automatic color control systems. It automatically balanced contrast and color adjustments to produce correct colors and color levels in the picture; I understand the ColorTrak system also used a photocell, located beneath the CRT, to adjust brightness and contrast according to room light conditions.

A variation of the original ColorTrak system is used in today's RCA tube TVs; the new system is no longer referred to by RCA as ColorTrak, but the automatic color circuitry works on the same principle (without the photocell). Modern RCA tube sets have not only automatic color control systems (defeatable via a menu option in the user control panel, accessed by means of the MENU button on the set or the same button on RCA remotes) but also circuitry which monitors (and corrects, if necessary) black levels, to keep blacks from washing out. These circuits are what RCA refers to as "black stretch" and "black lock" systems (at least that's how they are described in the advertising for my set). These three systems work together to produce a pleasing and accurate color picture; they are much better, IMO, than the first ColorTrak systems in RCA sets of 1970s vintage.

The ColorTrak system was preceded by what RCA called "AccuColor." The latter was simply a button which, when pressed, disabled the front-panel color and tint controls, while activating preset controls for color, tint and contrast (the latter were set at the factory, probably using color-bar test patterns rather than actual television programming, and are the defaults.)

Many other companies, among them Zenith, Admiral, etc. used the same type of preset color control system, although Zenith's "Color Sentry" was in fact a true automatic color control system. The company advertised this feature in its ads for its late '70s consoles by the phrase "think of it as a control room in your set." This was, I think, in direct competition with RCA's ColorTrak system of the same era.

The Zenith "Avanti" was a 25-inch color console in a white pedestal cabinet, with simulated rosewood on the top and sides. This model was introduced by Zenith in 1972; the original had the old-style detent VHF and continuous UHF tuners, but no remote. Yours looks like a slightly later model since it has several refinements the original Avanti did not have, such as Space Command remote control and Zoom, not to mention the vertical channel-selector window with continuously-variable tuning (via electronic varactor diode tuners, which were the first electronic tuning systems; they preceded today's quartz-synthesized cable-ready tuners) for each channel.

BTW, on the subject of quadraphonic sound, you may be right about the other poster possibly (even likely) referring to his system having an 8-track quad stereo tape deck (and, of course, being completely separate from his TV--we'll just have to wait until he posts the pictures of the system, I guess). There were several Zenith integrated stereo systems of early '70s vintage which incorporated 8-track tape systems, though many of them were straight stereo, not quad. I had such a system (with a stereo 8-track deck) for 17 years and liked it a lot (even played some 8-tracks on it, though I used the single cassette deck a lot more since most of my music was and still is on cassettes). When I moved four years ago, however, I gave it up and bought my present system, an Aiwa CX-NA888 AM/FM/cassette/CD 240-watt bookshelf stereo with 8-band graphic equalizer and surround sound. It sounds much better than my Zenith system ever did, but then again these modern systems, particularly the better ones such as Aiwa, Panasonic, et al, do generally sound much better than did even the best integrated systems of 20-25+ years ago. My Aiwa system will produce a simulated four-channel effect using four amplifiers, but with only two speakers (three-way--woofer, tweeter and a powered subwoofer in each enclosure). I don't know for the life of me how they do it, but the system sounds good to me, so what difference does it make as long as it works as it should?

Your friend had a very sophisticated Technics quad receiver. I remember those systems with the small oscilloscope on the front panel, which was used to balance the sound from each of the four speakers. The quad era was interesting while it lasted, but unfortunately it ended when the decade of the '70s did (though I have a feeling it was on its last legs already after 1975 or so).

Hi Jeff, thanks for that great post!

I've heard about the horror stories about the '92 and later "Zeniths" (the name goes on before they're shipped from Korea) :puke2:

You nailed what I was getting at regarding the RCA tube having the newer style (better?) masks. Some old timers have told me that genuine Zenith tubes did seem to last longer than RCA ones, but that may end up becoming the Ford Vs Chevy battle (which by the way was won by Chrysler! :huge: )

If you were to interchange the tubes would you then use the yoke from the chassis that the tube is going in (to match the circuitry) or the yoke that went with the tube? (to physically match the neck)

What you said about the Avanti is spot on as I've found this picture since I my previous post (see below)

Anthony

Re:Re:70's Zenith
 

I would think you could use the same yoke with either tube, as RCA and Zenith CRTs are basically identical except, of course, for the brand name.

As to the issue you mentioned with the size difference between the neck of the Zenith tube and that of the RCA: I don't think it makes much difference, to tell you the honest truth. I have read posts on this forum from people who have successfully replaced Zenith CRTs with the much more reliable RCA tubes, so obviously it can be done.

I think if you're talking about vintage tubes (well, mid 80's and earlier) Zenith is the clear winner. I've seen dozens of weak RCAs from the 60's, 70's and early 80's, but not a single Zenith that wasn't at least usable. Any delta gun CRT should by highly interchangeable as long as it physically fits.

In-line CRTs can be troublesome because the yoke and electron gun have to be designed together for the convergence to work properly. Some swaps work great, others don't. Ususally you end up with the green raster being either too big, or too small vertically if there's a yoke mismatch. Even Zenith CRTs of different types are incompatible (eg. 25" CRTs from the late 80's won't replace a mid 90's CRT). Both convergence and purity are impossible to get perfect. On the other hand, I've put 90's 20" RCA (Thomson) CRTs in Zenith sets from the 80's with no problem at all other than removing the bonded yoke from the RCA. The quality of RCA CRTs definitely went up after Thomson bought RCA. I see a lot with shorts, but if there are no defects like that they last a long time. I've never had any luck swapping yokes from one chassis to the other. You always end up with a picture that way too wide, or narrow.

You can't always go by the brand on the CRT. My Zenith 15Y6C15 has a Zenith branded CRT with an RCA EAI code. I guess it was made before Zenith started maiking 15" CRTs. The CRT looks great too.

Pictures Of 1975 Zenith Grandpaw
 

This TV was made in Jan. 1975 and cost around 1800.00 new.

More Pictures
 

1975 Zenith

1975 Zenith
 

1975 Zenith

1975 Zenith
 

1975 Zenith

1975 Zenith
 

Last Picture

What a fantabulous set Charles. Huggy Bear would be super proud to own such a pimpin' TV as that.....diamond in the back, sunroof top......diggin the scene with my gangster lean....:king:

Anthony

Regarding CRT interchangeability, I think that the sets that have 31 or 32 kv on the delta-gun CRT (like the RCA CTC-68) should only be replaced with tubes that can safely handle the higher voltage. The CRT's used with tube type sets are generally rated for a 25 kv anode supply.

Baby Brother Zenith
 

Ok now that I've seen all the cool consoles (Damn I wish I had a bigger house!!!) Here's my 19" Zenith. It's aready in my 70s-style computer room, complete with purple walls & purple sculpted shag carpet.

I must add that the photo does not do justice to the picture quality on this 25-year-old set. It gives up NOTHING to a modern set in terms of sharpness, black level or color quality.

Not a TV, but....
 

... I couldn't resist throwing in a picture of the Transoceanic 7000-Y that lives near the TV. I got it from Ebay a few months ago. Since most everything sucks on TV and top-40 radio, I figured I'd get an 11-band shortwave set.

Fine radio, Carmine. You need one of its Tooob older brothers to go in yr '50s room...-Sandy G.

Gorgeous radio, Carmine. Do you find that the sound quality of the older units beat the current ones? I sure as heck do (don't have a Zenith Trans-Oceanic, though).

I have a similar chromacolor II but probably just a a year or two older. Same white pedestal base etc. The picture and sound are great but the color is all messed up. I am new at this so please be understanding.

What can I do to fix up the color?

1. Most of the time it is greenish.

2. Sometimes some of the colors come in

3. None of the picture or color adjustments on the front or back of the television do anything.

4. I love the television and would like to keep using it.

Thanks

Maybe this will help
 

Hi,
Sounds as though the yoke has slipped from it orginal setting on the picture tube.
The yoke is the big plastic thing that slides over the "neck" end of the picture tube (the back of the tube).
Look and see if the rubber wedges are in place from the tube to the yoke. If the yoke has slid back or the wedges are gone you will see the print where they were on the back of the tube.
If this isn't the problem then I would try replaceing the color board or "chroma" bord. Sometimes just cleaning the connectors will do the job.
Hope this helps.
Chas.

I have a Zenith K-731 AM/FM table model radio from 1963 (an ebay find last year) that sounds better than any table radio I've seen or heard in years. It sounds like a console and even looks it (it's in a large, heavy walnut table-model cabinet). In some ways, it sounds even better than my Aiwa CX-NA888 bookshelf stereo.

Thanks Charles,

I took the back off and reset the yolk and things are working great again. Where are the chromacolor boards? I shipped the set from LA to Nashville and then drove it down to Texas so it must have come loose. This site is great. Thanks for the advice.

Mark

Thanks for the people that have helped with my zenith chromacolor. I sometimes get normal color. Picture is always sharp but most of the time color is just yellow, sometimes things that are suppose to be red are actually blue. But most of the time there is no real color. When the color is normal it is great. I have taken the advice and have reset the end of the tube but nothing helped. What else can I do. I love the set and would like to get consistant normal color. Help. Mark

Mark, Welcome to AK!!!!!!!! My story is about the same as yours. I worked on sets in a shop as a kid (my Uncles) He was a Zenith dealer right up until the time Zenith went down the tubes. Those Chromacolor 2's are great sets when they are working but can be a pain in the ass to fix when they start screwing up. Contact points and stuff are a real bitch. When they are working correctly tho you will not find a set with a better picture. (even new sets in my opinion) Does your set have a normal black and white picture? If it does, my guess would be a bad chroma module? I have some Zenith modules and will send them to you if I have any you need. Just send me a list of the ones your set has. It's gonna be a 9- something. I wish I had the first new tv I ever had. It was a Zenith 19" System 3 tabletop, in a solid wood cabinet with Space Phone! Anyway... give a hollar if I can help, and good luck!

Sorry Mark, I was getting you confused with the new member Punk Rock Dude (in case you were wondering what I was talking about in my post) Offer still stands though, Hollar if you need any modules. Also Doug is pretty with it in figuring stuff out, so any advice he gives will be one to pay attention to!

Mark (atomicpunk),
Hello, I am Jeff (also called here PUNK ROCK DUDE). I'm gonna get sidetracked just a second. I see punk in your user name. Are you a punk rocker or does it mean something else? OK. I was studying on the color problem with your Chromacolor (II?) Zenith. The problem sounds like it is intermittent from the way you describe it. Do you have the older flat solid state chassis, the flat 4 tube hybrid chassis, or do you have the newer vertical fold down type chassis? There is one thing common to all 3 of these chassis- the Chromacolor switch on the front of the set. The Chromacolor switch has male terminals and a female plug that it connects to. This isn't real apparent until you take the tuner assembly out. Anyway, a problem I have run across frequently on these sets is that the male terminals on the Chromacolor switch get tarnished and dirty (black looking). When this happens it can cause the front panel controls (color,tint,etc.) to not work at all or maybe intermittently work. If the Chromacolor switch terminals are dirty take a soft white pencil eraser and gently run it over them until they look clean. Once they are clean a light application of silicone spray helps to keep them from getting dirty again. If that doesn't seem to be the trouble you might try using the handle end of a small screwdriver and lightly tap on the chroma modules while watching the screen for any changes. All the flat chassis whether hybrid or solid state have 2 seperate modules that pertain to color. These modules have IC's mounted on them. One thing I have had happen to these modules is bad solder connections on the IC's. Hope this helps you out with your set- good luck. Let me know what happens.

Jeff (PUNK ROCK DUDE)

Hi
I also have a Zenith Avanti that I've had since about 1975. I am thinning my collection, gettin old ya know, and I will be selling it on Ebay. Anyone know if there is much interest in this set or am I wasting my time. :)

This is an addition to a previous post. In addition to my Zenith K731 pictured in my last post here, I also have a Zenith TransOceanic Royal 1000-1, an ebay score a few months ago (the first transistorized T/O, from about 1958-1962; somewhere in there). The 1000-1 is the Royal 1000 with an AC adaptor jack. Mine came without the battery compartment (most of these radios are missing this component, from what I have read here and on other antique radio websites), but I was able to find one at John Kendall's Vintage Electronics (www.vintageelectronics.com) about a month or so ago. Haven't used the radio on batteries yet; when I do use it, I plug in the wall wart (fortunately, the set shipped with the original Zenith transformer). The AM reception on this unit is great; I get stations which are just barely audible (or not at all) on many of my other vintage radios. One of my favorite stations is a 0.5-kW oldies station about 35 miles east of here; the T/O gets it just fine all day and into the night, until the station signs off or drops its power (don't know which, as there is no warning before I lose the signal--no announcement, etc.; a standards station in another town some 50+ miles away just goes silent when it signs off--again, no announcement or any kind of warning or notification that its broadcast day has ended). No matter. The T/O still gets that station and the one I mentioned above just fine while they are on the air. Not surprising, considering that the Royal 1000 series, and probably all T/Os up to the Royal 7000 series in the late '70s, had high-performance RF stages (the '1000 has an RF amp stage ahead of the antenna, as I am sure all other T/Os did). I also have a Zenith model R-70 AM/FM portable which seems to work just as well; gets the 500-watt oldies station every bit as well as the T/O, despite the fact that the R-70 was manufactured some 20 years after the first T/Os (and has no RF stage ahead of the antenna, not to mention having most of its circuitry on a PC board rather than being hand-wired). Just goes to show how well Zenith's older radios (and TVs--I've had a few) were made.

How did the 'zoom' feature actually work on this set, I mean, what did the set do to accomplish it since back then they didn't have video chips, video memory etc.? I remember my sister had one of these and it was weird being able to push the button and it clicked and there was the zoom (lousy resolution of course as it was not startign out with HD to begin with)...Frenchy

Essentially they made the retrace time extra long and the trace time shorter, but normal amplitude. You saw only the center part of the picture, no centering control. We used to joke that it should be called "bazoom" because that was the part of female stars you were likely to zoom in on. Once the man of the house did that in front of his wife, it likely never got used again.

HA! You got that right. I remember selling those in the shop new, and that feature was available when VCR's first came out. Not alot available in pre-recorded movies, but there surprisingly was a fair amount of Porn (on Beta). You just know those people that bought those movies were using the Zoom....... I have a 1979 System 3 that has the Zoom feature, so I wonder what years Zenith had it available. I know they had it on Chromacolor 2 sets, so I'd guess mid 70's thru the early 80's.