chromacolor or CC II?
 

I found this, and I wanted to know if it is a Chromacolor or a Chromacolor II? Speaking of that what would be the difference between the two?

Thanks!

Link : http://drummondville.kijiji.ca/c-ach...AdIdZ364245484

Well it's definitely not circa 1950 I know that.. :P

Not sure what kind of Chromacolor it is though.

Haha, that was the easy part! I really hope it's a CCII but I really don't know the difference between the two, but if I had to guess I suppose the CC is less desirable than the CCII. Now i'd like to know why! :)

Upon some further inspection, it looks like it's a Chromacolor II.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...a.jpg~original

I think.

EDIT: Then again, here's a standard Chromacolor, and it's chassis' knobs line up with the above posting.

http://www.videokarma.org/showthread.php?t=160351

That's a 19" 4-tube hybrid chromacolor from around '72-'73. Chromacolor II's consisted of the last-run horizontal chassis solid state sets from '74 and all of the vertical chassis solid state sets. Tube sets and the early solid state sets were simply known as "Chromacolor".

What's your take on it? Worth saving? what are the major issue with it?

I guess what i'm asking is : is it as good as a CCII?

Those had very good pictures and it's certainly worth owning. The only tubes in this set are for the horizontal output, horizontal osc, damper, and vertical output. The rest of the set, including the HV rectifier, is solid state. The most common failures are the HV tripler and focus divider. Also, the damper tube socket would sometimes arc and burn. Otherwise, they only gave the usual troubles that other sets gave.

Great,thanks! I have to admit, I have next to none experience in dealing with tube set and this bother me, I would have much prefer a SS CCII. But I'm am curious, so i'll get it anyway.

I'd grab that in a heartbeat. IMO those 4 tube hybrids put out a better picture than a CC2. Out of all the sets I have, my 4 tube hybrid puts out the best picture.
That set should be "plug n play". You shouldn't have to recap anything.

hybrid sets are some of the best.this zenith,the sylvania d16 chassis and even the magnavox hybrids were great sets.the ushered in the modern era of television.grab this one!

IIRC model D4034P 4 tube hybrid. All features except remote.
Like system 3 CC2 was a feature list I think it had to be SS to
be called a CC2 but that was 40 yrs ago ! The E- line sets
dumped the pedistal & went with consolettes, a maple
& a pecan one CC2.
Worth saving not super rare, they sold fairly well.
Very easy to deal with & must have made a million of
the hybrid between B-line & F-line so parts are there.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Dont worry about the tubes, most of the set is like the flat
SS chassis. Besides the flat SS only went in 25" sets, if you
want a 19" your stuck with the hybrid.

73 Zeno:smoke:

That's a 4-tube hybrid just like my chassis 19CC19. Mine has the 6LF6 horizontal output..superb CRTs in these sets. Mine had a great picture as found, needed purity adjustment and tuner cleaning only. from 1972.

Thanks guys, I'm going to pick it up tomorrow, i'll let you know when I get it and I'll post some pictures :)

By the way, any of you guys have any vacuum tube in case those in the set are bad? I'm asking because there is e few listing for the 6LF6 on ebay right now and they are kind of expensive.

thanks again!

Agreed...

Charles

IIRC a 6LX6 subs but also expensive. Most sweep tubes are
being bought up by hams using them for finals in home brew
transmitters. A parts set would be nice but most hybrids
are series string & use 20LF6 / 26LX6. If the set is good &
you want to keep it & want backup parts look for following OEM
parts.

78-1888-01 damper tube socket
800-616 (IIRC) focus divider kit
63-9115 vert size control

73 Zeno:smoke:

Am I correct in that the original tripler and focus divider in these sets can be replaced with an NTE526 tripler that contains a built-in focus divider?

Probably but but I never did it. IIRC some B-line hybrids didnt
have a divider. A lot of variations in the HV on them.
Remember the red ladder shaped tripler & the huge disc cap
that arced ? Wish I could remember the mod when the cap
went, I think you had to update the tripler ? I kept a few of
the caps for testing, Zenith said NEVER replace one.

73 Zeno:smoke:

replace tripler and hi divide with nte526 tripler unit.a nte556 will actually work in this application too

So I'm back from getting the Chromacolor, and you where right it is a hybrid! The television does "work" and the tube is good, I guess... But it's not the beautifull butterfly I though it would be!

Cosmeticly , the television is great! And it does have a really good sound :yes: But on startup I do not get snow, only a blank raster. and once the dvd is hooked up to it, The picture is full of color bars. The image also has some imperfection on both sides.

What do you guys think?

The black on the right hand side is likely due to a horizontal output defect (weak HOT, damper tube) or a bad filter capacitor in the power supply. When you turn the color control down, do you have a normal B&W picture?

If I remember correctly, the black and white picture had a little color in it.

IIRC, there is a slide switch on the chassis marked "normal" and "align". If the switch is dirty or in the "align" position, it think it will cause a symptom similar to yours.

Looks like it will come out nice !

1) the minor width problem may be the HV control has a
bad spot, common, used to stock it. Just turn it a little & it will pop in.
2) we did change a lot of filter cans on these. It can be changed
without a chassis pull but you have to be very careful.
3) degauss thermistor 63-10710 IIRC prob fell apart.
4) turn off chromatic switch & turn color all the way down.
if you still have color bars / blotches you need to
do purity & crt set-up.
5) lack of snow most likely IF transistor but could be something else.

Let us know how it goes.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Ok here goes :
1) the HV , is that High voltage control?
2) The filter cap is the big metal can on the right back of the chassi right?
3) I guess I need a service manual! haha anyone as one for the 19DC12 chassi?
4) By the way, would you consider the tube still good? it is on the low side...

thanks!

crt will be fine.its actually not on the low side.its in the green.even a tired zenith crt will produce a fine picture.this set will be great when you iron out a few bugs.horizontal issue is probably just a touch of the control.the color should pop in when you get it centered.damper or horizontal output could be suspect also.no big deal.excellent set and we sold plenty of these hybrids in the shop days.the picture was so good that customers would pass over the newer solid state sets for these.never saw one that didnt make a bright,sharp,clear picture.very good find!

Thanks guys, I really appreciate your tips!I guess I wanted so badly this set to be in pristine condition that I was was dissapointed when it wasn't haha. I now have 8 TV , and the only one that doesn't really have an issue is my 1984 system 3, and event that one has a little crt burn in it.

Time to get my insulated tools and start the work on those! :)

I was reading thru your symptoms upon start-up.
I would do the simple stuff first, before tearing in and doing all of the cap stuff (I doubt they're bad)
I would:
1) Clean the tuner
2) with your DVD player ( or whatever input source you use) tune it in with the AFC off.
Hopefully it's just a few dirty controls. The only thing that had me concerned was the blank raster/no snow issue upon start-up, which is probably just an adjustment to the AGC control.
As for the slight "pull"... probably a weak horizontal output or damper. You'll know for sure if it fills out after it runs for awhile. And ya... if one of those tubes were weak enough, it could effect color sync, which... just like that slight "pull" would clear up after it's on awhile.
The focus looks great on it, so obviously no tripler/focus divider issue......

1) yes the one above the HV label. IIRC it uses a strange tool
you can use something else carefully if so.
2) yes but dont change it unless you have to or its leaking puss.
3) maybe, I do sell SAMS & prob have it. If you need I will PM you.
Can help you along without it if minor probs.
4) yes it looks pretty good. Just remember it wont be as brite
as a newer set & may not take high contrast. Watch in
subdued lighting, thats normal to do in those days.
BTW if you need to pull the chassis or tuners you will need an
extra long 1/4' driver. Excelite used to make them.
The wood comes off first DONT forget to pull the 3 side knobs.
Then if need be to pull everything out of the cabinet......
IIRC 4 screws on bottom, 4 tuner screws & knobs,
3 screws along top edge, front controls 1 on bottom & 1
from rear. Remember where ground straps went. Comes out tube & all.

73 Zeno:smoke::smoke:

So, I finally decided to have a go a this little gem.

- First I tried to rock the HV switch a little CC and CCW, it didn't do a thing.
- I played with the AGC delay pot to see if the colors or the snow would come back. No effect.
- When I engage the chromatic switch , I loose the image completely.
-When I wiggle the tuner a bit, I loose the picture, then it kicks back in...seems shaky.
-I have no color, and with the color switch all the way ccw I have a black and white picture with color in it. (see picture 1)

Now, I haven't cleaned the tuner yet, but I wanted to ask you guys an updated opinion first.

Thanks!

If with the color control up you still get the same bars as in post 20, then what you need to do to fix it is look for the 3.58Mhz Chroma reference transformer, and adjust it's slug until it synchs...At that point the color bars should go away and you should have a color picture, though it might still look a bit funny if the front tint/hue control is mis-adjusted.

Interesting, color in the pic with the color control turned all the way down when your CRT checks reasonably good. I have been wondering if that was a surefire indicator of a bad CRT because I just got a 1983 Toshiba Blackstripe set that shows a lot of color with that simple test. I don't want to dump it because the person who gave it to me said it was hard for her to give it away because it was her dad's TV. Also, it seems to be a less common model. I might end up stealing a CRT from one that's more common. It has a few other minor ills and could use a Retrobrite treatment as well.

You have a badly misconverged image -the blue lateral is off a bit, but red and green seem converged, giving the yellow lines. The black stuff at the base of the tube is the rtv rubber zenith used to hold the tubes in place for shipping. Dust away the salts and she'll be fine.

Zeno can chime in on this one -I've not worked a Zenith hybrid in a while, as dura module sets are plentiful in my world.

Cheers,

Good to see it on the bench.
Minor width problem most likely H. output tube.
damper & H. osc tubes also possable and filter can
( in front of tripler ).
The CRT looks very strong. Blue lateral is the white
part on the neck. Has 2 rings with tabs for purity &
the twist magnet is the blue lat. Give that a turn to put
the blue on the yellow. Clean tuner & hopefully the
snow comes back.
Chromatic switch. Note the color, tint, bright & contrast
knobs have holes. There is a second set of controls for the
chromatic. With it on ( orange ) the regular controls dont
work you use the screwdriver to adj it. When off the outside
controls work.
Color problem.
1) clean normal/align switch on top of chassis between the
color module. If that dont work......
2)remove the 2 color modules ( 9-27 & 9-?? ) if the IC's
are still plug in remove them & clean sockets. Be sure to note
the markings to put them back in right. Spray the module
contacts also. If that dont work......
3) put on a color picture. Put norm/align switch in align.
Adjust the APC control on the 9-27 board for the FEWEST bars
rolling through picture. Return to normal.
That will keep you busy for a while !!

73 Zeno:smoke:

Good news!

After rocking the normal/align switch a little (I didn't even cleaned it) color came back!

I fiddled a bit with the blue lateral to adjust convergence, and voilà! Convergence still need a bit of tinkering, but i'll get to that later.

Now I need to find the focus pot. Looked around for it and I could not locate it. Haha

All in all, I am amazed that the TV came back so easily, you guys where right, those are very reliables TV...and the tube is still very strong!

here are a few pictures, the first is for comparaison to earlier B&W picture, the others are before/after blue lateral magnet adjustment.

And as always : Thanks!

Edit : I just found the focus pot. For some reason it's labeled as "vert. centering" on the chassis, that why I couldn't locate it.

Now that the color is back and I don't have the lines anymore, I probably don't have to go through this precedure, but I am curious : what does a chroma transformer do? does it sync chroma and luma to get a color picture?

It has no effect on monochrome synch. The monochrome horizontal synch pulses contain a sample of the carrier used to detect and decode the color signal. That sample is called the burst, it is gated and used to synch the 3.58MHz reference osc. Tube era sets and some SS sets have an adjustable transformer used to bring the frequency of that osc. close enough for the osc. to synch to the burst. The phase difference between that osc. and the chroma signal determines hue of the color, and the amplitude of the chroma determines how saturated that color is. If the osc. is off in phase people will have purple faces, and if it is off in frequency you will get horizontal bars of RGB, or a constant tinted monochrome image.

Rapid progress ! Nice work. You cant beat these sets to
learn & experiment with.
If the color is lined up properly you should be able
to change channels WITHOUT the color coming on with
color bars before locking in. If it dont deal with it later.
Next is the minor width problem. Be SHURE you are actually
turning the HV reg control, see if it goes from stop to stop.
Most had an odd adjustment that you had to jam a tool in to
get it to move, not just the usual screwdriver adjustment.
HV controls with a bad spot give exactly the minor width
problem.
The filter can is a quick test but the sides are strait so I think
thats OK. After that scare up some KNOWN good ( not tube tested )
tubes. When the width is fixed its time for a complete
CRT set up.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Well, there is a slot in the HV reg control and I can see it turning and I hear HV changing in the TV while I do it. Now I don't want to overdrive the TV as I don't have an HV probe, but I rocked it 1/8 to 1/4 turn (cc and ccw) just to see if it does something and it didn't.

As for the tubes, I should get an 6LF6 and the 3 others as well?

Wow that's a beautiful picture! I'm glad you got it working, I like the console tabletop look the cabinet has. I don't think I have ever seen one in person.