60's color motorola
 

Picked this Motorola console up yesterday. It was pretty far away from me and more than I would of normally spent but the thing is in near perfect shape. It has a cataract like most do, but it could be worse than it is. The guy told me that he plugged it in and it didnt do anything. I got it home took the back out and gave it a look. none of the tubes look cooked, no brittle wires just dusty. Picture tube was replaced in 72'. Any ideas before it gets put into storage for another 40 years??? :scratch2:

plug it in see what happens. maybe a popped circuit breaker. Typically I do a whole startup process that consist of..

pull Horz Out tube(s)
Pull Vert out tube
DC volt meter on B+
AC volt and AC current on variac
check B+ overall resistance (before doing any power up) should be around 7-10k
it the B+ over all is ok, then crank up the variac and watch for the B+ to come up while keeping an eye on the AC current.

if all goes well I generally go to about 400vdc on the B+ slowly with the variac while feeling the filter caps. If they stay cool and the overall current seems reasonable (about 1 amp for the filaments, the rest of the set with sweep circuits disabled will not pull much), then I will put the output tubes back in and do a full power startup, this time with a HV prob on the CRT anode and a current meter in the horz out tube cathode circuit.

All of the above sounds like a lot, its not, but I just like to play it safe. You could just plug it in, see if anything lights up, if completely dead I would suspect the power switch or a circuit breaker. If the tube start to glow then you could just wait and see, keeping an eye open for smoke.

I did try to just plug it in after I posted. Nothing. Circuit breaker seems to me normal, I sprayed a little cleaner in case it was stuck. I dont know about the power switch. Pull on push off twist for volume. I guess I could jump it, I dont have any extra switches like that, although I have a few tv's I could snag one from...... I get a nice hardy click when I pull the switch but Im sure that doesnt mean anything.. Is it really worth trying to get to work? I know some early colors are fussy but Ive never really come across a moto. :scratch2:

That's the first production run of the TS908 chassis. It still uses the octal base horizontal output tubes and vertical output tube.
The CRT looks like a Sylvania rebuilt, with the yellowing resin. :scratch2:

You are right it is a Sylvania tube

Before going any further I would check for continuity of the primary side. Just alligator your meter leads across the A/C cord input and cycle the power switch. If nothing then short out the switch. If still an issue then you may need to pull the chassis and do some point to point checks. I would not plug it in until you find out what's open.

sometimes is just the plug too. check the AC cord out.

It isnt the plug... I used a different one with the back off. Im going to take a peek under the chassis in a bit.

Does the set use a thermal degauss relay? If so, it was a frequent failure point. I don't remember if it was on the primary or secondary side of the xfmr. Been a lotta years.

From my years working on those, be sure to check the CRT. If bad you may want to reconsider your goals. The general consensus of the period, and my opinion, was the 23EGP was the worst (and definitely the most expensive) CRT of the period. And not all sets can be converted to the 25AP/XP CRT.
Also check the condition of the tube sockets on the main board for being brittle and bad pin contacts with the tubes. Over the years I had to replace more sockets on those sets than I care to think about.
Good luck and have fun.
Phil

you know when you plug a tv in for the first time or after ones been sitting for a bit and the lights dim for a split second when you plug it in? it doesnt even do that. I guess id call it "charging up" but it doesnt do a thing. I was thinking of jumping the circuit breaker and seeing what happens. I dont want the thing to explode or catch on fire though.. I have a feeling thats the culprit.

Nice find! My parents had a B&W Moto with the same cabinet. By the time I came around it was their bedroom set and a '68 Quasar was in the living room.

Those were one of the first rectangular color CRT sets ever. They sold really well at the time. I've read in a couple of places that they even outsold Zenith color consoles for a short time. However, there seems to be few of them left, probably because of the CRT problems.

This may sound simplistic, but did you check for continuity in the power cord? Are you sure your outlet is still working? If there's a dead short in the TV it could have tripped the breaker on your outlet.

If you don't plan to keep it and you're anywhere close, let me know.

i used a modernized version of the power cord thats interlocked to the back, back off cord in and no power at all. outlet works, I dont have any sketchy ones in my house. Is it possible to bypass the breaker? theres one thick red wire to it and a thinner one on the other side. I took the service panel off the bottom and put the set on its side. Not one melted or burnt cap. i dont know what to make of it. Im in CT, so if you are close by I will keep ya in mind...

In most sets I've seen the breaker is in the B+ line so it should not cause the filaments not to light. In your shoes I'd trace the power cord from one prong to the other and find where it is open circuit. Jumper bridge any opens you find...Except for the power transformer primary(if that is open you are more or less SOL).

If I had a 23EGP based set I'd check that the CRT still has good emission before spending much time or money on it.

when i tipped the set on its side a round magnet looking piece fell out. i found where it was, between these 2 wires soldered on. could that MAYBE be the issue? im thinking about soldering it back in, but that seems way too easy and i dont see how a magnet would complete the entire circuit for the set? its a magnet a little bigger than in inch between the 2 wires shown in the picture

That's a Thermistor, either for the Degausser or to soft start the set.
One type increases resistance with heat, the other decreases.

You could twist the wires together and see if it makes a difference but if it is the degausser you don't want to run it long that way because it could burn up the coil.

If the tubes light up and you don't hear a loud humming sound from the degaussing coil then it's probably okay to run it.

You can also try to solder it back together, if it sticks together then it should work.

could that be why im not getting any power? it does look cooked off, is it possible to solder it back on? ill use insulated pliers to twist them together, i dont need a zap tonight!

I'm pretty sure that was a varistor or thermistor not a magnet.

It's a surge limiting thermistor. It might be in the transformer primary circuit.
Just jumper it for now and see if the set powers up. Those sets were so reliable, outside of the CRT, I don't remember all the problems, that were related to that chassis.

Just be sure it's unplugged before you do.

ok, well im going to give it a try and see what happens.

Eric thank you. that made it turn on and no hum. the tubes started to light up but i got nervous and shut it off LOL.

when i leave the set on for about 30 seconds theres a crackle static noise coming from the back..it isnt the speaker either... theres no smoke, no arcing that i can see but i cut the power quick. im not sure if its the guns or something.. it sounds like its coming from the yoke. do the old color set sound like this normally or is something cook'n?

That's called a thermistor. It's purpose is to divert electricity to the degaussing coil on start up. It gets very hot doing it's thing. So hot that it eventually falls off the two leads.
The power supply is wired so the electricity has to go through the thermistor before reaching the transformer. Bad thermistor = no electricity to primary of power transformer = dead set.
Twist the leads together (solder if possible) and you will get power to the transformer.

i jumped it with mini alligator clips for now, it did power up but the crackling at about 30-45 seconds its nerve racking- it sounds like the static you get when you shut off a set thats been on for hours.... the picture tube doesnt really have a chance to fire because i cut the power before it would due to the noise.

Sorry guys, I failed to notice there is a page 2.

Rob, that's the fun of playing with the unknown. You get the nerve racking experience. But you have a bunch of good guys covering your back.

Give me the exact model number and a private message. I'll send you a copy of the schematic (Sams Photofact). You'll need it.

Phil

i sent you a message, thanks guys for all the help so far

The crackle is probably the high voltage coming up, it's normal.
Turn up the brightness and check for light on the screen.

i will check tomorrow on that and keep everyone posted- im gonna call it quits for the night. lets just hope i dont cook it tomorrow ;)

i wanted to throw this out there too... the crackle i hear is kind of loud, but gradually builds the longer i leave the set on.. so if it is the high voltage, it may just sound loud because i have the back off, thats my only guess

sorry got behind did not see you got the HV going.

What he jumpered was the surge protector thermistor in the AC line coming in.

Just curious, what does the schematic show for the degausser?
On the Motos that I remember (Moto was not our house brand, so we didn't service many of them), the degausser was some kinda strange thermal 'relay' device mounted on the front chassis apron. The part was reputedly very troublesome, though we never had occasion to replace one.

Or does this set use the standard thermistor/varistor setup?

If the HV crackles loudly for more then 10 seconds after power up then something is arcing and that arcing will need to be fixed.

Has the set been stored in a dry place? If damp you could be getting some corona from that, no big deal really. I suspect the noise is normal, can be caused by excessive dust though this one seems pretty clean. Hard to say for sure without being there in person. I would normally just stand back and let it go, see what happens. Have one hand near the power switch, just in case. Remember, it won't jump up and attack you-the worst that can happen is something will fail. I'll say, I think this is a desirable set. An attractive design, to my eyes, and I think Motorolas have lots of character. If you can't figure it out, don't junk the set. Somebody else on here would love to have it, I'm sure.

Nice set there;). What is the number of the replacement CRT in there? Just Curious.

That thermistor is not required but helps your set's components last longer by limiting inrush current to the transformer.
A type CL-60 thermistor will carry 5 amps and can be used in place.

BTW my first repair, to my childhood TV a 1962 Motorola 19" BW, went exactly like this;
mystery part open= thermistor, hissing crackles=arcing high voltage

Good Luck, Id have driven hours for a set like that too

the set is pretty dusty inside, and it was actually in the old owners living room all of its life until i got it. Im gonna brush the dust out and give it a go when the comes up...

sun comes up... 5:15 is too early on a sunday

heres some good news guys... i turned up the brightness, turned up the sound a little, cleaned the controls and all the dust, cross my fingers plugged it in and got..................... a nice bright screen with snow and sound :)

Hurray!!!!!! You got a good one!

i hooked it up to the dtv converter box, it does get a picture but its black and white?