Can a Zenith 9-160-030 sub for a 9-160-05?
 

Like the title says, I want to know if they can safely interchange.

I have a NICELY working 13" that uses the 030 and a nonworking 19" space phone set that uses the 05. The 05 looks like it has had a hard life....many burned and bridged traces lots of wear, evidence of servicing, etc, and I'd like to confirm it is the problem by substitution with a known good module before I jump in and try to fix it at the component level (assuming there is enough left of the 05 to fix).

I think the 03 was subbed to an 05. you're going backwards.

Edit - Not according to Zenith. The -04 is the only sub for the -05
http://videokarma.org/attachment.php...7&d=1440701676
http://videokarma.org/attachment.php...8&d=1440701676
http://videokarma.org/attachment.php...9&d=1440701676
CRSP CRSP CRSP - that is the Zenith compatibility manual - remember the title, and the search is easier:

http://videokarma.org/showpost.php?p...89&postcount=7

Cheers!

It's the first time I've worked on a SS Zenith.

Thanks, but that manual lists no subs for 9-160-03 (but it does not say to NOT use any specific variant), and 05 crosses to 04.....It is inconclusive. Perhaps I should just hook it in, start my variac at 70V, and hope I get picture and not smoke.:scratch2:

...

Seems to me when I was working on those Zeniths back in the days, I used to sub those. However I would look at both of those boards and see what differences and changes were made between them. I don't believe you will smoke anything out by subbing them. I'd go ahead a give it a try. Can't hurt. If it doesn't work, at least then you will know.

??? Not according to the CRSP - Zenith's definitive word on modules. In the beginning of the System 3 series, Zenith had a high rate of return on modules, and determined that techs weren't following the manual - weren't checking for proper Horiz drive, B+ and so on when swapping modules. The CRSP wasn't in independent service techs hands, so they got a mailing list for shops and mailed each one a CRSP. The result was a drop in module returns (Surprise, that module is not for that set....!) and in a humorous note, some techs wrote Zenith and asked for a subscription to the CRSP. Zenith actually added those independents to a list, and when the CRSP got updated, they got new CRSP manuals.

At one Zenith Seminar in early 84 (I attended with my dad's former boss, A Zenith dealer), they showed a set that was serviced using the wrong module, not sure of the combo, but swapping the wrong module had damaged another module. They also showed off a mod to the ultrasonic remote tester that allowed a tech to check for horizontal drive, a test that allowed you to isolate the fault to the correct module. The ultrasonic remote tester we had already had the IR mod, but I brought back the mod sheet and modded ours - just a resistor and coupling cap - the whole tester was built around an op amp driving an LED to show the pulsing of the remote signal, or with the Horizontal drive mod, the pulsing of the drive signal.

Bottom line is, use the CRSP and avoid the problems. It also lists all the duramodules and some digital modules. I have scanned about 80% and posted in various threads - just search CRSP.

Cheers,

I swapped hundreds of 9-160's
IIRC -03 subs to -05
-04 subs to -06
there was also a -08 ( rare) that subbed back to one of them.
An 05 or an 06 will sub ANY 9-160 between them.

IIRC you can not put the wrong one in due to the
yoke plug without forcing it & busting the skt.

IIRC also the newer subs used a multivibrater to kick
start the set & the old ones a transformer etc.

On some, remotes IIRC there is also a cable that gets
left off on a sub. Plugged on top & had 2 wires. Just
tie it off out of the way.

73 Zeno:smoke:

9-160-05R Was the 25Kv HV Module.

9-160-06R Was the 30Kv HV Module.

9-160-08 or 09 were not available as rebuilt as far as I know.

Does anyone have an older CRSP book I was thinking until the 08 and 09 came out it was odd suffix subbed odd suffix and even suffix subbed even.

The one above:

9-160-05 = 9-160-04

9-160-06 = 9-160-04

Which most likely isn't correct ?

Why would Zenith have made both the 05 and 06 as rebuilt replacements ?

9-160-05 would sub an 9-160-03 but not an 06.

9-160-06 would sub an 9-160-04 but not an 05.

But the 08 and 09 mixed things up a bit.

I think I still have the service seminar for the 9-160 series book somewhere.

Then 2 weeks later the told us not to repair any of them exchange only.

rrrhre2s

I've repaired a lot of them and have even replaced arcing flyback transformers on them; but, I always installed a used flyback (usually, in something I was fixing for resell) because the local parts house didn't have them. I was told that Zenith didn't offer the flyback by itself and when it failed, they wanted you to replace the whole board.

Never put an FBT in one. The FBT probably was a $30+ part & the whole board a little over $50 Xchange. Swapping the board takes 5 mn,
changing the FBT adds time & wait for part. In the house only
changed board or resoldered. If it had a shorted HOT we changed the board. Other things like PC cons, filter cans, the 32 V regulator
we would fix only on carry ins.
We tried a few HOT's but like a Sony they often ran perfect for weeks
then on a turn on BANG. If you gotta make a living you dont
want that over your head. Fix it fast & keep the customer happy.
Gotta remember this is one of the 3 most complex sets built as
far as PS/Hoz sweep goes. RCA SCR & ITR sets ( and clones) & Sonys with 2 SG613's were the others.

73 Zeno:smoke:

Okay, I'm going to at next opportunity try to swap the boards. If it works with the 160 from my good set, then I'll try to fix the bad board, and if that fails buy another.

I thought the stream of 9-160 modules dried up 15 years ago ?

Or do you mean another set ?

Beware I have had the 9-152 to damage the 9-160 rare but possible.

Found the training manual for the 9-160 service seminar, quaint reading today.

I had forgotten just how complicated that board was in it's day.

Anybody forgotten the Motorola (Quasar) JA panel ? (was too far ahead of the technology at the time)

rrrhre2s

They never seemed complicated to me. Very easy to figure out. I never bought a rebuilt board. I always fixed them myself those sets paid the bills.

7 CRSP manuals, two from the service caddy, and they all say the same.. The one above is a scan from the blue CRSP, believed to be the last one we used, as the others are stained, dog-eared, and dirty. One doesn't even list the -08 or -09, so probably old. The sequence adds models, no additional information or cross. Our first four or so came as hand-me-downs from a Zenith dealer, and the last few, were included in module orders from Zenith/Bluefield Distributing.

Everyone with "I imagine, IIRC, and I seem to think" - Zenith says otherwise. I have no problems with what others do with their sets - just passing on the facts from Zenith. If someone has contradictory CRSPs, please post for the benefit of all.

Edit: Somewhere I have the PTS Electronics cross reference as well - I'm gonna dig it up and scan that - they may have other info as well...

The filter cap went south on my Zenith System 3.
It uses the 9-160-05 board
Was wondering on the big 2 section cap, if that is what one tries to get when replacing caps on the board (if even still available) or if you just replace it with 2 caps?
Also.. for those who have rebuilt this board, anything else to watch out for, or re-do?

Use 2 caps & be sure any grounds tied by the old can are retied.
Go over the PCB real good for cold joints, there ARE some.
Check the 200 V supply filter cap. Right rear near FBT.
IIRC 10 mfd 415V. There was also a lytic in the H drive that
could int kill the HOT but I dont remember the details.

73 Zeno:smoke:

From Zenith Factory service information.

9-160-03G, 05D, 05E, 08A Module CM 133 / 4-43C 26Kv Board

9-160-06D, 09A Module CM 133 / 4-43F 30Kv Board

11-1981

Manual CM-133 section 4-43.

Unless key is broken off the yoke interlock will not attach without forcing it.

rrrhre2s

The capacitor that causes the board to keep blowing the HOT is located behind the HOT heat sink 47uf at 16v across two low value resistors (value varies with version of the board. This capacitor was a CX meaning it was related to safety.

Run the set 15 minutes remove power check the temperature of the HOT heat sink if more than just warm replace the capacitor.

Later boards were reworked to eliminate the 2 resistors and capacitor in parallel. Note the driver circuit was also changed.

9-160-06
R3324 replaced with a jumper.
R3334 0.18 ohm 3w

9-160-05
R3324 0.33 ohm 3w
R3334 0.18 ohm 3w

Have problems reading the copy I have may have the numbers wrong.

The 0.18 ohm resistor is on the emitter of the HOT.

The 0.33 ohm resistor is between the base and the horizontal driver transformer.

rrrhre2s

well.. the set didn't blow the hot. (Perhaps I caught it quick enough?)
It's pulling in from the sides a bit, and I have a hum-bar in the picture.

Your thread hijack is reminding me I need to finish that board swap...

Well I tried the swap about a week ago and the results seem to be no/inconclusive.

A couple of the 2-pin connectors ton the topside do not seem to be the same place or letter. I did hook it up and nothing was damaged, but only got ~5-7KV of HV and no sound. I then put the working 030 variant back into the working 13" set it came from and that continued to work (so no harm done). I then examined the non-working 05 variant, and found a major coil had badly cracked solder lugs, and decided to re-touch all bad looking solder joints as a final try/courtesy before junking it. That fixed the audio hum, but got me no HV so before throwing up my hands in disgust with the set on I wiggled some of the connectors on the back of the 9-190-05 and it suddenly came to life.

There may not be interchange in the way I wanted, but I did get both sets working. :D
https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1561/...bae318d8_n.jpg https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1664/...60f67f93_n.jpg https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1708/...752a928e_n.jpg https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1470/...66c66fd2_n.jpg https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1554/...c241f97b_n.jpg https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1635/...c042c6ec_n.jpg

Well...you SURELY have a pair of good tubes !!