10" or 12" Blonde Maggie!
 

This set looks rather interesting. I wish it were closer to me. I like the looks of this television. Such a large cabinet for such a small screen. Hopefully some Aker in Mich will seek out this set.


polaraman

http://cgi.ebay.com/Old-Magnivox-Tel...QQcmdZViewItem

polaraman -

Thanks for the tip. I'll take a stab at this one. Jonesville isn't far from here...

-k

Photofacts for same
 

You might also want to check out the photofacts available right now for the Magnavox ct 220, if you happen to get the tv.
Donald

http://cgi.ebay.com/_W0QQitemZ230008664026

http://cgi.ebay.com/_W0QQitemZ5814152215

Donald -

Thanks for the photofact tip. I bought one of them. Got the TV too. Thanks again Polaraman for pointing it out. I think I'll try to document this one thoroughly on AK, start to finish. Maybe get some good feedback if (when?) I run into troubles restoring it.

- Kirk

Looks as though there was a pretty good bidding fight for the television. What CRT is in that set? I would love to see the work being done on the set.

polaraman

I thought my $50 bid would get it sfter the first competition bailed at $25. Lucky I stayed around 'til the end, my 2nd bid was $100, just barely made that. A tad more than I wanted to pay, but it looks like a worthy set to salvage and hopefully won't need too much more $$$.

I'm waiting for a reply to set up an appointment to go get it. No details until then. Looks like a 10BP4 but maybe it's a 12.

I'll start with a complete recap, then resistance checks (assuming the Sams sheet has a table of resistances). Then a variac power-up. I'll shoot pics and post, for sure.

I'm hoping the set was manufactured in Fort Wayne. Capehart and Magnavox were cross-town rivals back in the heyday. My Magnavox radios are from here, but I don't know for sure if the TVs were made here too. Will be fun to find out.

-k

Just picked up the TV. Looks pretty solid and relatively clean. It's spending the night on the truck as I didn't get home 'til dark. I verified it's a ten-inch CRT and verified it was made in Fort Wayne. Did that while loading it up, darkness fell as I reached home. Will shoot pics tomorrow.

Wonderful drive to go get it. Jonesville being well off the beaten path, I love midwest towns that haven't been corrupted by interstates. Very cool '50s root-beer drive-in a couple miles from where I picked up the set, a very clean, "vintage" Americana town. Lots of corn too, of course.

Only drawback was the 100-degree heat. Made it a long drive home. More info later.

You did not look for an old Tv shop? :nono: Go back and look! :D Sounds like prime territory to find an old Tv shop filled with goodies! We all have dreams of finding that Tv shop filled to the rafters with pre 1960 roundies.



I can't wait to see pictures and details on the set. There is a big Maggie collector here. Murpho has not been here in awhile.


polaraman

Some photos.

CRT is a non-aluminized 10BP4 with ion trap.
CRT brand: RCA. Would this necessarily be a replacement? Did Magnavox brand their own CRTs? One of the tubes is branded Magnavox, most of them are HyVac.
Data plate says: Model: MV13BS Style: T119-337 Volts:117 / Watts: 250 Cycles: 60 Serial No:T-52718 (photo was last-minute clipped to meet the 900-pixel max width the forum allows).

More later.

Chassis and cabinet "de-loused" remarkably well, couple of spiders notwithstanding. Compressed air gun and an old toothbrush dry-cleaned everything metal, damp paper towels for everything glass. Time to separate the chassis from the cabinet...

The ultimate man's workbench, the tailgate of his truck! TV chassis is clean underneath, couple of Sprague Orange Drops in fresher solder says this set was serviced later in life. Lots of replaced tubes too (G.E., Tung Sol. Hy-Vac, RCA). Suggests this was somebody's working set for a long time.

The 4 or 5 tubes that are still branded Magnavox have date codes of late 1948 or early '49. If that means much. No way to know if they're originals.

On truck bed, opportunity to clean it up to the point where it'll come in the house without releasing spiders or any other bugs.

On a clean workspace now.

5U4G tests 81/82 with no unexpected shorts or grid leaks. A good start. Will probably test all the tubes this evening, then that's enough for one day.

Set had 8 bad tubes (haven't tested CRT yet). I had 7 of them on hand, one I had to go online to find (a 6SF7, fairly rare tube). My favorite supplier (Killduff Five and Dime) had one, then I ordered some spares from other eBay sources so I can put a couple on the shelf too.

Speaker came out clean. PM Type. No tears, coil has continuity. Alligator-clipped it to an audio source (Transistor radio). No issues, sounds good. 11-inch diameter, Magnavox label and part number.

Unusual hard-plastic cone mounted to the inside of the speaker grille, presumably offers some added acoustic value.

Glass faceplate wasn't made to come out. Took a long time to get it removed without breaking it. Nailed and spot-glued and masking-taped in place. Then a lifetime of whatever was windexed or coca-cola spilled down the front, into the tablesaw-cut groove in which it was nearly-permanently seated. Got it out though. Cleaned up well.

Final de-bugging of cabinet. Clean enough to come inside. No more working on the truck bed.

Sams sheet arrived in the mail today. The 6SF7 from Kilduff's shipped Thursday, is due on Monday. Just studying the Sams sheet tonite. Gathering up capacitors. Probably will have to order a few of the 500V Electrolytics from Mouser.com.

Just wanted you to know I appreciate the pics!

Ok. First things first I wanted to make sure the chassis isn't "hot" (after a fellow AKer this week spoke of getting "tingled" when his set was plugged in one way, but not when the plug was reversed). So first test was to ohm each side of the plug against the chassis. Guess what! One side of the plug was indeed somewhat shorted to the chassis (500 Ohms). Even with the power switch off. That made tracing it down rather easy. The two black-plastic "line filter" capacitors shown here, one was toast.

...so this evening was about cutting out sticky ooey-gooey (probably chewy) wax-paper capacitors and replacing them with Orange Drops. Pictured is 23 of 29 caps replaced. The four big ones remaining are .25mFd@400V which I didn't have in stock -- to be ordered soon, with electrolytic order already planned. Two more wax caps are not plainly in sight in the photo. Looking forward to getting the new Orange Drops, to put the messy job behind me. Mouser.com usually delivers 2nd-day, I'll make the order up probably tomorrow (after I inventory the remaining electrolytics). There are two electolytics in the photo (leftmost, bottomish black one, and topmost, lefmost end-view). I don't have those on hand either (20mFd@150V). Then of course the multi-section cans on top. Those should be an interesting topic, for another day...

The set has an unusual Hi-Voltage cage interlock -- when the cage cover is bolted into place, a sheet-metal tab fits thru a slot in the chassis and rests up against a spring-loaded toggle switch in series with the main power switch. No cabinet-back interlock like we're used to seeing -- I guess Magnavox at the time figured the "low Voltage" side was safe enough. The rest of the chassis is ready to rock, no cheater-cord required.

As you can see, I replaced the two "line filter" caps with equivalent orange drops as well. The 500-Ohm short went away -- no more hot chassis!

More later. -k

Made my capacitor order with www.justradios.com. Mouser.com let me down on selection and on price this time. 4 or 5 days I should have the parts to finish the recap. Maybe work on the cabinet over the weekend... -k

Capacitors arrived from www.JustRadios.com in about 6 days. According to the US Post Office:

Electronic Shipping Info Received *, August 10, 2006
Enroute, August 12, 2006, 7:43 pm, ATLANTA, GA 30369
Enroute, August 15, 2006, 12:33 am, ALLEN PARK, MI 48101
Delivered, August 16, 2006, 11:32 am (home)


Excellent capacitors. I highly recommend them.

Last night I installed the remainder of the orange-drops and three electrolytics, so the underside of the chassis is completely recapped (photo). Replaced one of the topside electrolytic multi-cans, first time I ever tried "re-canning" one with discrete capacitors (keeps an authentic appearance by salvaging the original can). Went very well. I'll photograph the next one in progress. It's probably the most time-consuming part of the whole job. Assuming all else goes straightforwardly.

Topside electrolytics C1 (A, B, and C) and C2 (A, B and C) are done. C3 and C4 left to do, then this stage of the task is (finally) done. As viewed from below-chassis (note the perfboard and heat-shrink-tubed wire connections on the lower two circular areas). Details next post.

Top View.

3 discrete capacitors, matching the ratings called for in the specs, are mounted on a small piece of perfboard. A hole is drilled in the center of the perfboard first to allow the ground-side (or "-") wire to exit. The Positive ("+") sides are mounted to the face of the perfboard, the "-" sides are common, soldered together at the top, with a wire coming back down the center and thru the hole in the perfboard. The "+" leads are left long and sticking thru separate and reasonably-spaced perfboard holes. A quick solder at the perfboard foil holds it all in place.

Mount the perfboard to the chassis where the original can used to be. This isn't an unpleasant sight as-is, but if you want you can wrap the caps with just enough electrical tape such that the original can fits snugly over the trio and reasonably resembles an original look.

You can glue the perfboard down, drill and screw or rivet it down, or (as I chose in this example) tie it down by passing salvaged clipped capacitor leads thru two perfboard holes and the thru the original tab holes and then "twist-tie"-ing the perfboards down. This seems like the least intrusive method, if somebody wanted to undo my work later.

Wire up the capacitors thru the perfboard, as originally wired (shown in-progress). Use plenty of spaghetti tubing and heat-shrink to make sure everything's well-insulated. When taking the old can out, make sure you label all the loose wires (ex: my green post-it tabs).

You can see my "twist-tie" method of mounting the perfboards. It worked well, if not terribly elegant.

Two down, two to go. I find this part really tedious, so I'll tackle the other two tomorrow.

- k

Some progress. FYI. -k

One last way-out-of-tolerance resistor was dragging down the height (R96 of Sams 82-7). Replaced that, lots of height to work with now. Had some retrace lines and bad linearity/centering (the Bones/Justice pic). Set up a mirror and found a balance with the Vert Lin, Height, and Vert Centering controls that gave a pretty linear pic, vertically centered, and minimal retrace lines. Put the glass faceplate temporarily over the pic tube to make sure the height matches the height of the mask (Pepsi truck shot). I like it. I guess it's done.

Looks great so far. :banana: Assuming that this is your current state of affairs
http://audiokarma.org/forums/attachm...chmentid=26063
you're almost home. Looks like it needs some work on the vertical output. Possibly just adjusting the vert height and vert linearity (they usually interact with each other). But a weak but passing on the tube tester output tube can cause this. But usually leaky caps (but you replaced them all, yes). High value resistors (above about half a megohm) are known to drift high. so check the resistors in the vertical circuits.

As it is, I see that your flyback is healthy, picture tube looks good too. And the deflection yoke looks like it's good too. Those are hard to find replacements for. And the tuner and IF must also be working well enough to at least get a strong TV station, or your VCR. :banana:

I now see that you got the vertical fixed. good job. :thmbsp:

Looking good :thmbsp:

John

Fantastic picture! Nice work! :thmbsp: I take it the cabinet is good enough to leave alone and does not need re-finishing?

Doug

I plan on block-sanding the cabinet top with 600 and finer paper and re-clearcoating it. The original clearcoat is flaked badly and has a few water-rings (and is a little dirty). The sides are fine as-is except the veneer is lifted in places. I'll have to glue it down again. Other than that, it's good.

What;s new on the Maggie? Got any more pictures? I'd like to see where you are on it. Thanks. Bill Cahill

Oh. I was watching that set too. Nice set. I have a1947 Maggie combination 12" tv, am-fm-sw radio, two speed phonograph.

Bill -

It could probably be tweaked a little bit more but for now I'm calling it a "wrap". It's an ornament in one of the bedrooms right now. It's pulled somewhat away from the wall to hide a VCR behind it for photos, normally it's against the wall. I'm currently recapping a period-correct UHF converter to put on top of it so that it can be occasionally used for nostalgic viewing (no vhf stations nearby). It's a good solid set and a satisfying restoration. Should be no problem using it in light-duty mode.

Your MX combo console likely has the same TV chassis. According to my Sams sheet it came in either 10" or 12" models, and mine has a socket for the radio/phono inputs into the audio-amp section of the TV chassis. I think one or two tubes in mine have survived from day one, the date codes on all the Magnavox-branded tubes were from spring of '49 (I had to replace several of them, but one or two remain). So I'm calling mine a 1949. The ad photo below confirms this (from April '49 Saturday Evening Post).

Post a pic of yout '47. Thanks.

- K

man that is lookin good kbmuri :thmbsp:

Good thing you restored it, or your evil twin would have done this. :D

I would have kept the original blonde color myself, but, nice job. It will be awhile before I can get you a pix of mine. I have amp, changer, and all spkrs. out now. Tweeters are shot, and,I'm trying to figure out what to do. I prommisse as soon as I can, and get some help from someone to install pix.,, I will. Mine is mahogany. AM-FM-Sw radio. Push pull audio. 4 6V6 push pull parallel. No tuning eye, though! Strange that a Maggiee wouldn't have a tuning eye. Back panel has the cut outs for it, but, front clearly shows No cut out for the front of the eye. Seems to be, otherwise, the same basic radio chassis used on their deluxe radio combinations.Even has the min. tube for fm oscilator. Rest of radio tubes are octal.I think you are right on the tv. They sure seem to look the same.

By the way. I learned something else the hard way. Don't stand in you stocking feet on a terazol floor, and go to adjust the tv by grabbing the brassh knobs! It's a shocker!!!!! :nono: :rolleyes: :eek:

Bill -

I wasn't sure if the socket on back of the chassis was an audio-in or an audio-out connection. It would work as either, as it's just the line between the audio discriminator 6al5 and the audio-amplifier 6SF7, isolated with .01 mfd caps, and chassis ground. Inject a signal there, you'd get it amplified (and chassis volume control would affect it) thru the onboard single-ended 6V6 amp. Pull a signal from it, you could drive your 4x6V6-PP external amp. So for the console set, the socket must be an audio-out, not an audio-in. I would guess your 6SF7 and 6V6 (and transformer) are then omitted on your chassis.

The previous pics were taken dark to show the picture tube working. I didn't go out of my way to change the cabinet-finish color. I don't think it was ever "blonde" in the classic sense, just a light hardwood veneer. The pull-down front-controls cover is in fact left as-found (I didn't have to touch it). The rest of the cabinet had a lot of flaws and required light sanding and re-clearcoating. This photo, taken in bright light, most accurately reflects the color (and flaws). Someday I might re-veneer the whole thing, and reproduce the front facade (which is light-colored solid hardwood). But that would be a lot of effort, and perhaps a crime to the "originality". I think I'd rather take the entire cabinet, wrap it in plastic, and store it in the garage rafters for posterity, and reproduce the entire cabinet in an exotic tiger-maple hardwood. That would be even more work, but it would be something really beautiful afterwards. It was a "budget" set to begin with, and likely wasn't ever a nice piece of furniture. Just an "entry-level" way to see TV in 1949. I suspect your combo set was the "deluxe model". It sounds like a great set.

As far as the shock hazard, I really don't like those 2 capacitors from the AC line to chassis ground (see about 20 posts ago). One of mine was leaky and made the chassis hot, perhaps you have the same condition.

Good luck working on it.

- k

Awesome post kbmuri !! :thmbsp: :thmbsp: :D :D :yes:
Wonderful work restoring an old beauty!! :yippy:
Great pictures!

Thanks so much for sharing!!!

:guitar: :beerchug:

Indeed, a wonderful job. Thank you for sharing your project.

Actually, I see from ebay there were more deluxe versions than mine. Mine is conservative, though beutiful. The other two are book cases, rather large, and both beutiful. Mine is relatively compact, yet, has the same wood beuty as hose. I remove the line caps completely when I re build, They are a shock hazzrd. Also, any resistors going to chassis as well. After I get caught up on customer projects, I am going to get back on my Maggie. Then, I can post pics for you guys to see.

Slightly off topic. After I receive my delivery from our friend Polaraman, after cabinet repairs, I will show patched up case. After I start re building chassis, I will show progress pics on it.
That set is my favorite project=RCA Victor=6T74=rplacement for original family set.

Bill Cahill :yes: :banana: :thmbsp:

Not a problem -- glad the series of posts appealed to its audience. It was fun work too.

I'm swayed towards getting the 2nd "Monster Maggie" on eBay (the one at a reasonable starting price). I think the two sets are identical, except the 2nd one lacks the top "detachable crown", which makes it look like a plainer model. The photography is poorer too, making it look like less of a set. But I think they're both the same thing. I don't know if the crown was lost on the 2nd set, or if it was optional to begin with.

Unfortunately North Carolina is just too far away. I drove to Cleveland a couple of weeks ago for my first Zenith color roundie, and that was an ordeal. NC would be a weekend at least, and probably a Ryder truck rental to put it in. Hundreds of dollars and headaches. I'll have to pass.

Polaraman should go get it...

Bill, I look forward to seeing your Maggie when you get around to it.

On the line caps, I'm leery about leaving my set plugged in when I'm not using it. The line caps are connected to AC and chassis, even when the TV's power switch is "off". Anybody have any strong feelings on that? It's how it was made, factory, so it was expected to be used that way. Just wonder how safe it is. I almost re-wired them to the OTHER side of the power switch, which makes more sense, but didn't feel like modifying the original circuit. Curiously, it's wired that way in the Sams schematic, so I could have re-wired it to match. Maybe Magnavox realized the error later in production, and Sams got the later version? Sure didn't look like my set was modified. It was a curiosity.

Anyway, thanks for the kind words. Maybe another project pretty soon...

- Kirk

They make special line caps that are designed to fail open, and not catch on fire no matter what. It's an excellent idea where the caps are always on. Use a "y" rated one for line to ground, or an "x" rated one for sets that have it across the line.

John