Hoffman 2021 Info

[jbeary]

Hello All,

Would anyone have a Hoffman 2021 schematic that they would be willing to part with? I'm also looking for some front control knobs as well. I'd be willing to trade. Thanks in advance!

Regards,
Jeff

[Tim]

Jeff:

The Sams index comes up with models M2021 and B2021 roundie. Folder is 385-3. If no one surfaces with an offer to send you a scan, I'll copy and mail it to you. Got any of the knobs still there that you can take a photo of?

[jbeary]

I'll get the camera out tomorrow and post some pictures of the set. I'm not sure if all of the knobs are the same on the front, but I'd guess they are. I really appreciate the offer on the schematic. The set is pretty beat up and will take a bit of work, but I want to go ahead and start on the chassis because the CRT tests perfect. It'd be a shame to part it out...

Thanks again!

[reeferman]

My info says the set is a knock-off of the CTC-5. But it doesn't say if it has the cheap demod circuit (12AT7), or the superior X & Z (6BY6) demodulator. Would you fill me in on what it has?

[Tim]

Reeferman:

I just checked the schematic. 6BY6 - X & Z.

[peverett]

Please check the website below. This is a listing of Hoffman knobs that he has.

http://www.radiosalon.com/knobs/hoffman-1.htm

[reeferman]

Glad to hear it's an X-Z. MUCH better picture

[jbeary]

Hello All,

Thanks so much for the info on the M2021. Knowing that it's got the later technology makes me feel better about taking on this project. It will take a complete redo but I would like the picture to look as good as the cabinet will. What's weird about this set is that there was a couple of models (B2021 and P2021) where the cabinet was finished. My guess is that the M2021 was the least expensive color TV available in 1957 ($595 retail) and this is why the set I have survived. I'm sure that whomever bought it intended to keep it for a really long time although from the condition of the CRT I'm really not sure how much use it's seen. Anyhow, the cabinet is veneered with the grain painted on like you see in many of the cheaper Hi-Fi's of that era. But it's not made of masonite. There's actually real wood under the paint! And what's positive is that the veneer looks good! No peeling! So it ought to strip and refinish nicely. The bad part of that is that I'll have to completely disassemble the set and take the CRT out to do anything and it's not like I can just do the chassis, I'll have to do the entire thing. On my schedule, that'll take at least two years! One thing that I have to admit is that if I had to have a Hoffman, this would be the one I'd want because their cabinet design leaves a little to be desired. I haven't seen the General or the President models, but the Ambassador is one fugly piece! In fact I have a Hi-Fi that is styled similarly to the Ambassador and my wife says it's too ugly to bring in the house. Nice piece, but even I have to admit it's on the iffy colonial side of design.

Anyway, here's the pics. Please, please please, if anyone has any front control panel knobs, please contact me at [email protected].

http://kerrybeary.com/M2021.jpg

http://kerrybeary.com/M2021_2.jpg

[Steve D.]

Nice Hoffman. Your "Colorcaster" model M2021 is the "Commodore" in Mahogany finish, $595. The P2021 is the "Commodore" model in Salem Maple finish, $615. These, along with a Limed Oak model, comprised the price leader sets in Hoffman's color tv line in '56 & '57. As mentioned they correspond to the RCA CTC-5 Super series and use the RCA Deluxe chassis with some Hoffman engineered modifications. Make absolutely sure the cabinet is real wood under the printed Mahogany finish. If it's hardboard you'll never be able to refinish it. RCA's low priced color sets had photo printed finish over real wood on the front only and hardboard top/sides.
Good luck with your project.


-Steve

[jbeary]

Hey Steve,

Thanks for the kind words about the Hoffman. Would you know if there was another company producing color TV's during the 50's that sold a set that was less expensive than the M2021? I can't find one. What I think I was trying to say was that Hoffman obviously had to cut corners to sell this set so inexpensively. But when others did the same thing (like RCA as you mention) they used the hardboard or Masonite around the frame of the cabinet and then painted it. I have an Admiral from 1954 (I forget the model number) that is constructed with this crap (incidentally I stripped the finish off and repainted the cabinet bright red and it looks better than original if you ask me because I don’t like dark furniture). It also had the appliqué of Mahogany and frankly I’ve always have been interested in how much the companies using this process actually saved the consumer. I feel like Zenith did more to retain the cabinet styling while compromising the quality of pieces and parts. For example, there were many Zenith black and white “bug-eye” sets built in the mid to late fifties that all pretty much look the same but some were obviously engineered better by using better tuners and power transformers. This Hoffman chassis in my 2021 was used in the least expensive model as well as their more expensive console models; at least that’s what I know. Granted many companies manufactured TV’s using Masonite but it’s my honest opinion that the cabinet used on the M2021 is the same that is used on either the B2021 or P2021. In all fairness I have not seen either the B2021 or P2021 models but I can imagine Hoffman cutting twenty bucks off the price because the Mahogany cabinet went through a one step finishing process rather than a multiple step process for the B2021 and P2021 models. Either way Steve, there definitely seems to be real veneer underneath the appliqué.

Which leads me to another very important question; I know that most of you out there lean more to the electronics side of things, how many of you guys can restore the cabinetry as well? I see these old TV’s on eBay advertising that they’re electrically restored but the cabinets are trashed. Who wants that? Some people are buying these things to (God forbid) make fish tanks out of them! I mean a TV is an electronic device, but these companies knew that they were also making furniture and very often the question of antique furniture is will the piece ultimately be worth less if it restored? Or will the restoration benefit the piece greatly enough to warrant it. And is someone going to like looking at the piece enough to keep it in their houses as opposed to their leaky garages? Besides Steve, because I know that he wants his CTC’s to be functional pieces, how many of you guys actually use your TV’s every day or have them sitting dead center of the living room as they were designed to be??? It took awhile for my wife to get used to looking at black and white (we watch our CTC-7 about once a week as well), but I can do this because the TV’s WORK and LOOK NICE! So what’s more important???

All my best,
Jeff

[Steve D.]

Hey Jeff,

I didn't mean to imply that your Hoffman has the hardboard cabinet, only that you check before attempting to refinish. Your "Commodore" wasn't the lowest priced color set offered during that period. The RCA CTC-5 "Aldrich" Special model, with out the X&Z demodulation chassis, had a retail price of $495.00 for the Mahogany table model (legs optional). Both General Electric and Admiral offered Consolette models starting at $495.00.

The highest priced set available was the Philco Model 5102. Discribed as a modern console with genuine Stripe African Mahogany veneers fronted with luxurious picture frame moulding of solid mahogany. $895.00. I believe this set is pictured on the cover of "Color Television" magazine from 1957. The far left set. The cover can also be seen on my web page.

My RCA CTC-5 Wingate, $850.00, while not a daily watcher, sits proudly in a corner of my living room. It can be viewed on my web page. I dwell on the prices as a reflection of how costly these sets were in mid '50's dollars.

Source for these facts: "Color Television 1957 edition". Published by Radio & Television News
This is a great reference book for the Hoffman and other models.

-Steve D.

[Sandy G]

Awwww, man, that Hoffman is a Suh-Weeet set...would give my eyeteeth to runup on a '50s color set w/an intact CRT....-Sandy G.

[charliesheen]

hey jeff
well im better at restoring the cabnit than the electronics.my opinion is that its far more easier to sand and re-varnish,matter of fact thats the first thing i try to do,so if i loose intrest and try to sell it to somebody at least they will have an attractive piece.

[jbeary]

Thank you both Steve and Sandy,

I admit that I jumped on the set when I saw it only because these early model Color TV's are incredibly hard to find, not to mention find locally! I bought the Hoffman for $50 from some junk dealers here in town. Funny story, but my wife, who happens to work at their shop, came home one day and said that they had just got in an old TV and wanted to know if I was interested. They had the year right, but they also put "B&W" on the tag so she assumed that they were correct. So she say's "it's really beat up and missing most of the knobs" and I was like "forget it!" To make a long story short, about a month and a half afterwards, I was dropping her off at work and happened to walk her up to the door and instantly I knew it was color. I mean it says color all over it and I had to argue with my wife because they wanted $50 for it and it had been sitting outside all this time. Fortunately it was covered so no real damage was prevalent. These people know that I collect valuable stuff so they started asking how come I wanted it... well I just said because I thought it was a good project. Anyway, that's how I got it. Apparently it came from a family who had sold a house full of junk to these people and anyone who knows anything about the south knows that people around here just don't have much money. This is why I figure the set survived, because the people who bought it spent so much for it at the time they could not bare to part with it and let it sit for years until someone died. I go to estate sales around here all the time and I can tell you it's few and far between when you find something that's actually worth anything to anyone.

Steve! I don't feel that you were implying anything! I know exactly where you're coming from and anyone that I can share ideas with is wonderful! I'm learning more every day! I have the issue of "Color Television" you refer to (another super eBay purchase for $15). But I guess I haven't completely read it. That Philco is remarkable! In fact I'd love to have any Philco of that era. The CTC-7 that we have is a Townsend (the same as the picture Ed has up on his site at http://www.novia.net/~ereitan/Galler..._Gallery.html). Now set is right up my alley. And the best part is that it's in remarkably unmolested condition. Of course I've completely overhauled it and I still have to touch up the convergence. The color purity is off a little too but I know that I need to dial that in before I start futzing with the convergence again. Anyone would give their eye teeth to have that Wingate of yours, but I'd prefer the Asbury due to the styling. But let me tell you that the one you have is absolutely beautiful! The Aldrich looks very much like the Commodore but I'm very happy to hear that the demodulation is X & Z on the Hoffman and I can expect better results. Anyone that can offer any advice on how to proceed disassembling this thing would be greatly appreciated. And anyone who has yet to experience the color that these sets have to offer is truly missing something. I'm continually amazed at the greens that our Townsend produces and look forward to having that on another TV.

I beg the question though; isn't your CTC-100 worth more to you now that the cabinet has been refinished than it was before? Now that's a RARE set that some would say never touch, but I for one am so happy that you can present this set as it should be. What good is it to have a super rare set like this without going through the pains of complete and total restoration. If you're like me, you leave what you can, but with the advancements in capacitors (and I happen to subscribe to the notion of rebuilding the power supply with much higher value caps), why would drop a hot rod engine in a beater body?

I just need to learn more about these cabinet designs and the restoration thereof.

Thanks again and keep on Steve,
Jeff

[Steve D.]

Jeff,

Thanks for the kind words.
The original owner of my CT-100, an RCA employee, had painted it "antique white" at his wife's request. I had CT-100 parts all over the place while stripping the empty cabinet and refinishing. Happily my CTC-5 Wingate has its original, and like new, Maple finish. I can't believe those juke shop guys didn't notice the really colorful Hoffman color indicator knobs, not to mention the word "Colorcaster" on the front. Good break for you.

As for disassembly, a supplied copy of the SAMS should provide chassis and picture tube removal instructions. In any case, unplug ALL connections, DISCHARGE high voltage. remove the chassis,tuner & speaker first. The cabinet should then be placed face down on a padded surface before removing the picture tube shield, yoke and picture tube. Make good notes/take pictures of the location of all mounting hardware, purity magnets and yoke ect. The 21AXp22A tube is heavier then it looks. Use care, gloves & eye protection. Replace the cabinet upright & remove the mask & safety glass. Store all the parts together and out of your way!

-Steve D.