Late 50s philco curb find - Videokarma.org TV - Video

JGlenn · #1 10-26-2009, 08:51 PM

Ive wanted a 50s tv for as long as I remember and saw this the other day sitting out in the rain sadly. It was still out there today and it seemed to be in decent enough shape so I grabbed it. It looks like it could be a 56 or 57 philco diamond series? but the back panel is missing and its pretty grubby back there. Its marked 7L7 U on the chassis and 10302017705 and has a 21AMP4A picture tube in it which is a westinghouse and appears to be dated '63 so it was probably replaced at some point. Id like whatever info anyone has to give on it. Im really not sure what to do with it yet at this point. It seems like there may be some missing parts but it may still be salvagable although it did sit out in the rain for a long time

Ive never taken on a tv resto before and im not sure if I could handle it. Ive redone a couple tube amps before but this is a much bigger project.

Don Lindsly · #2 10-27-2009, 10:22 AM

That is a 1957 top-of-line TV. It is one of the best performing B&W chassis made by Philco. It uses a side mounted flat chassis. Some use a Top Touch motor driven tuner. That should be an easy restoration and produce an outstanding picture.

JGlenn · #3 10-27-2009, 12:03 PM

Cool thanks for confirming the year for me. I looked around and found adds from 56 and 57 with similar looking models but no perfect match. Where would I start with something like this? Its sitting in my furnace room now where its somewhat warm so hopefully it dries out. Should I try bringing it up on a variac or just replace all the caps first?

Don Lindsly · #4 10-27-2009, 02:14 PM

That is a matter of choice. I prefer to troubleshoot before a complete restoration so I don't accidently build in troubles. Give it a few days and start it slowly on a variac. Remove the 5U4 and let it cook for awhile with no B+. Watch for smoke or crackling. If the tubes light and no smoke, then put in a good 5U4 and repeat the slow start.

DaveWM · #5 10-27-2009, 02:15 PM

I like to put a meter on the B+ disconnect the HOT and the VOT (all tubes) and bring it up slow while monitoring the B+. If you take all the tubes out of circuit you can check for reforming of the caps, the current should be very low all the way up. You want to monitor the B+v also, with no plate loads you could go over voltage so watch that as well. If they come up ok, then I put the tubes in and monitor the B+ again (volt and current) to see if it comes in ok. I dont like a slow power up once the sweep circuits are hooked up, dont like the idea of a osc not oscillating due to low v, so that power ups is pretty quick (you already know the B+ is not shorted prior to the full powerup). Keep you eye on the voltage and current.

I like to keep the current meter on even after power up and it is running fine, at least for the 1st few hours of service.

opps I just realized the era, it may have a tube recifier, so you will need to leave that one in. Just be carefull not to go over V due to lower loads.

I also take a primary pt reading of ohms just to be sure its not a dead short (hard on the variac), I also monitor the AC current. My sets look like they are in the ER when 1st power up...

Charlie · #6 10-27-2009, 02:44 PM

JGlenn, I have one of those. Got mine just before Hurricane Rita, and that was what we had to watch during the storm as the new color set I had wouldn't pick up crap during that windy night!

I spent a couple of days going thru it... had lots of stuff to replace. Someone had already done a lot of work on the deflection board... looked like work from the 60's or 70's judging by the caps used. I found the chassis pretty easy to work on.

Back then, Don pointed out this was a great chassis as far as performance, and he was right! Once I re-capped everything, this baby played great, and still does today! I watch this very regularly, and haven't done a thing to it since the re-cap. In fact, I watched it last night for several hours. The sound is great on it as well! Mine actually had tubes in it date-coded from 1983 when I got it! The CRT had been replaced in the 60's.

This is one of my favorite sets... and to think I nearly turned it down! Glad I didn't!

Hope yours goes as easily as mine did!

Charlie · #7 10-27-2009, 11:52 PM

JGlenn,

You mentioned you think there may be some missing parts. What do you think is missing?

My DD had several issues. In addition to the bad caps on the deflection board (some of which were cracked open), I found nearly all of the resistors on that board to be way out of spec. It has one of those "combination components" in the vertical section that was causing issues. I made a new one from scratch.

Don had mentioned a 1000 ohm 1/2 watt resistor in the tuner that had a high failure rate, and he was right. I found it to be way out of whack. I also found two 470k resistors in the tuner that went south. One was open and the other was reading nearly 1 meg.

When you take the chassis out of the set, you must first remove the escutcheon where the front controls are. There are two small screws that hold it in place at the top and bottom. The plastic on mine was somewhat brittle where the screws are, so be gentle when removing and replacing them. Once the escutcheon is removed, then you have screws that hold the 4 lower knobs in place... those screws and knobs will come off as well.

There is a small 3-position switch at the bottom of the escutcheon for range. It's not very noticeable at first glance. It should be kept in the middle position.

Seems I recall there not being a lot of good room under the chassis for mounting new electrolytics, so, if you don't go with re-stuffing the original cans, you might have to get creative in finding spots to mount the new replacements.

Tubejunke · #8 10-28-2009, 02:53 AM

Philco flat out made some great sets back then. My best set is an unrestored 1956 Philco. It FINALLY used up a picture tube after around fifty years of faithful service. I am only 40, I got the set when I was around 13 at a Goodwill, it had a brightener on it when I bought it around twenty-five years ago, and I put a LOT of use on that tube, especially as a teen. It saw much more limited service in later years after I got out of the service. I guess thats how the tube lasted that long on afterburn.....

JGlenn · #9 10-28-2009, 11:23 AM

wow thats pretty cool. Looks like the tube in my tv has been replaced as it has a westinghouse label on it and I can see where the nuts that hold the tube bracket in place have been reinstalled. If im reading the date code on the tube correct its from the 39th week of 1963. Theres a few wires that are hanging loose in the back and what looks like some piggyback connectors to go in place of a small tube... theres also some quick disconect type connectors in the harness that goes to the picture tube that are just hanging there. I'll have to get some pictures. Charlie I see what you mean about the escutcheon around the knobs, its been off more than once and the screws have pulled through and there is a small crack in it already. Its still a useable piece though the set's no showroom example either after sitting out in the rain the sides are a bit warped. The safety glass is loose in the cabinet as well but that looks like and easy enough fix with some felt pieces or something to keep it from rattling. This set doesnt have the touch tuner option but it has two speakers and proudly displays that up front, Im not sure if they all came like that or not.

Charlie · #10 10-28-2009, 11:50 AM

Yeah the two screws on mine have pulled thru as well... but the knobs will hold it in place just fine. Apparently, if the chassis has been pulled a few times, those little holes get stressed since that has to come off to get the chassis out.

The connector harness you speak of might be for the deflection yoke.

JGlenn · #11 10-28-2009, 12:25 PM

some of it almost looks like it was added at some point but im not sure. heres a few pics.

the wires from that pair of connectors come of this transformer

heres the connectors that are pulled apart in the picture tube harness

looks like mine has a block off plate for that connector on the back of yours

this is the one that has me wondering what happened, its just clipped off and it looks like its been like that for some time.

Charlie · #12 10-28-2009, 12:52 PM

The photos are a bit fuzzy, so it's kinda hard to tell. The small transformer at the top of the chassis is your audio output transformer and two wires should go to the speakers.

Picture #3... cant really tell a whole lot.

Picture #4... that's your antenna connections. Two of those leads should go to the tuner. Also, that big shiny piece of foil paper in the top of the cabinet is your "built in" antenna. If you are using an external antenna, the leads going to the foil paper thing would stay disconnected. There should also be attenuator switch nearby for that internal antenna.

Can't tell much about that single wire by iteself.

The socket you see to the right of my antenna board is for the optional wired remote. The wires that go from that socket travel down to another socket behind the 5U4 tube (which looks empty on your set) and also goes to the tuner motor.

If you like, PM me with an email address, and I'll send you a much larger photo with better detail of the inside of my set... and maybe you can match up some of what's in your set.

JGlenn · #13 10-28-2009, 02:12 PM

yea sorry those were taken with a cell phone, I can get some better ones later when the wife gets home with the camera. some big pics would be awesome I'll pm you with my email address. your right about the empty socket behind the 5u4, at first I thought there was a missing tube and then I saw the harness plugged in there in the pics of your set and figured it was for the motor driven controls that mine doesnt have, your set is very nice by the way. Most of the tube in my set are replacements so it looks like somebody cared enough about it to keep it going for quite a while and maybe there wont be that much wrong with it.

JGlenn · #14 10-28-2009, 04:11 PM

I was looking at the wiring coming off that audio output tranny and those small connectors are wired in the middle of the line down to the speakers. Then I found a tag saying its been equipped with "phonevision" that looks about almost as old as the tv, any ideas what that might of been? Im guessing I should remove it.

Charlie · #15 10-28-2009, 06:47 PM

Perhaps there's a single RCA jack somewhere on the back of the chassis that would allow you to plug a phonograph into? I do not recall mine having that, but, if yours uses a slightly different chassis than mine, it's possible you might have that feature.

I wouldn't remove it till you find out what it is. I'm sure it's from the factory.